5 ms·

It has offered Edward Snowden a new place to call home. I love Iceland. I truly do. My wife and I visited twice last year. I think it would be a wonderful plac

It has offered Edward Snowden a new place to call home. I love Iceland. I truly do. My wife and I visited twice last year. I think it would be a wonderful place to live. Given a choice between Russia and Iceland I would pick Iceland without hesitation (although I have to admit that I have never been to Russia). However, I do not believe that they would be able to protect Snowden from the CIA. I hope Snowden sees this the same way and stays safe in Russia.

thomasville 10y ago
I hope he goes there and there then they run another poll which determines he should be extradited to the US to be held accountable for his actions.
- StanislavPetrov 10y ago
  The people of Iceland are intelligent, as evidenced by their jailing of bankers and election of the Pirate Party, so would not hand him over. If small-minded people cared 1% as much about holding their own government accountable as they did whistleblowers, imagine how much better society would be?
  - DocTomoe 10y ago
    You are mistaking "in accordance with my personal preferences and political views" with intelligence.
    - tingol 10y ago
      I don't think there's anything personal or political about corrupt people getting punished for their crimes instead of being bailed out without taking any individual responsibility.
      - DocTomoe 10y ago
        See, I do believe from what I have read that the icelandic banker's convictions were mostly a political move to keep the very small (and thus very easily rally-able) Icelandic population happy after their savings (which always do carry a risk - that's why you get interest) were lost in the icesave collapse. Just like them essentially declaring bankrupcy and not paying their debts afterwards was. And I do not think criminal cases should be influenced about what result is politically preferable.
  - HalfwayToDice 10y ago
    Iceland did not "jail their bankers", where do you get your news from?
    - ejlo 10y ago
      Hmm, did you try searching for it before posting? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008%E2%80%932011_Icelandic_financial_crisis#Judgments https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008%E2%80%932011_Icelandic_fi...
      - HalfwayToDice 10y ago
        I don't understand. There were 15 people jailed who took part in illegal activities. But the vast majority of Icelandic bankers did not take part in illegal activities. They just did a really really bad job. Therefore they weren't jailed. Unless you think that Iceland only had 15 bankers?
- stale2002 10y ago
  Sure, as long as the criminals who illegally spied on millions of Americans are held responsible for their actions as well and sent to jail.
  - yarou 10y ago
    The prisons would be overflowing. Not a bad pitch for the reintroduction of private prisons! :) When a system of government becomes so corrupt as to allow actual criminals to run for the highest office, there is something severely wrong. The hoi polloi, unwashed masses, etc are becoming politically conscious, but it's too late. We've all traded our freedom and privacy for fleeting digital experiences that ultimately have no meaning. We all chose this path collectively when we chose not to speak up for what is good and just. But hey, it's all relative anyway, right? In the end, the 21st century will be marked by nihilism and cynicism.
dharma1 10y ago
Yeah, I wouldn't, if I was Snowden. http://grapevine.is/news/2014/12/21/mfik-urges-investigation-of-icelands-role-in-cia-torture/ http://grapevine.is/news/2014/12/21/mfik-urges-investigation... Having said that, we don't really know on what terms Snowden is enjoying impunity in Russia. I doubt it has come as a free lunch.
poshli 10y ago
The PP is a fringe radical party that if they somehow become the majority party in Iceland, they're not going to retain it for very long. I would not recommend that famous dissidents like Snowden move there immediately. I like visiting Iceland too, the few Icelanders I know can't wait to move though. The winter weather and high price of everything is a bit of a drag. I am not an expert on Iceland but I have read that it's really controlled by interests behind the two main industries of fishing and smelting. Iceland is really pushing tourism these days, since flights to Iceland are incredibly cheap. I recommend reading The Grapevine http://grapevine.is/ http://grapevine.is/
- belorn 10y ago
  PP is a new party, but is it fringe and radical? Using social-liberal political philosophy[1] to focus on issues arriving from the digital Revolution[2], it seem like a very similar party to the green party but with a different focal point. We still have political parties today that focus on questions that arrived from by the industrial revolution. Unless we want to just delegate the digital revolution as a minor footnote in society, it might be time to view the changes in society as a reason to look at government and ask if it too should change. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism 2: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Revolution https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Revolution
- Broken_Hippo 10y ago
  I would guess that it isn't so much the winter weather and the price of goods that is making folks want to leave: I'm in Norway, which traditionally has expensive goods and bad weather. Everyone complains about their weather, but from my experience, the locals don't find it to be all that detrimental to life - I've had to learn to dress better for the weather and stuff like that. (of course, I don't know how strong the icelandic currency is at the moment, so that could be an issue for buying those goods). The second one - that it is really controlled by interests behind the two main industries - is likely much more key. Having a small island country with only two main industries makes it so that folks don't have as much opportunity as they would in mainland Europe or Canada. Not only that, but one of the main industries - fishing - can be rough work in itself. The place being an island also prevents some of the options for avoiding the high prices for goods: Here I can take a (free!) bus just over the Swedish border and buy things more cheaply, but they'd have to take a flight somewhere.
Grue3 10y ago
It's extremely naive to think that Snowden would move somewhere out of Russia. It's very obvious why he went there in the first place.
- ionised 10y ago
  > It's very obvious why he went there in the first place. Please enlighten us.
- gribbly 10y ago
  He went there because it was the safest route to Equador, once in Moscow, the US state department cancelled his passport. And just to drive home the dire situation he is in, when rumours were spread of Snowden being aboard the Bolivian president's plane headed for latin america, the US pressured european countries to deny airspace and have it directed to Austria where it was searched.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
gregman1 10y ago
So you have no idea what is Gluggaveður then=)

thomasville 10y ago

I hope he goes there and there then they run another poll which determines he should be extradited to the US to be held accountable for his actions.

StanislavPetrov 10y ago
The people of Iceland are intelligent, as evidenced by their jailing of bankers and election of the Pirate Party, so would not hand him over. If small-minded people cared 1% as much about holding their own government accountable as they did whistleblowers, imagine how much better society would be?
- DocTomoe 10y ago
  You are mistaking "in accordance with my personal preferences and political views" with intelligence.
  - tingol 10y ago
    I don't think there's anything personal or political about corrupt people getting punished for their crimes instead of being bailed out without taking any individual responsibility.
    - DocTomoe 10y ago
      See, I do believe from what I have read that the icelandic banker's convictions were mostly a political move to keep the very small (and thus very easily rally-able) Icelandic population happy after their savings (which always do carry a risk - that's why you get interest) were lost in the icesave collapse. Just like them essentially declaring bankrupcy and not paying their debts afterwards was. And I do not think criminal cases should be influenced about what result is politically preferable.
- HalfwayToDice 10y ago
  Iceland did not "jail their bankers", where do you get your news from?
  - ejlo 10y ago
    Hmm, did you try searching for it before posting? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008%E2%80%932011_Icelandic_financial_crisis#Judgments https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008%E2%80%932011_Icelandic_fi...
    - HalfwayToDice 10y ago
      I don't understand. There were 15 people jailed who took part in illegal activities. But the vast majority of Icelandic bankers did not take part in illegal activities. They just did a really really bad job. Therefore they weren't jailed. Unless you think that Iceland only had 15 bankers?
stale2002 10y ago
Sure, as long as the criminals who illegally spied on millions of Americans are held responsible for their actions as well and sent to jail.
- yarou 10y ago
  The prisons would be overflowing. Not a bad pitch for the reintroduction of private prisons! :) When a system of government becomes so corrupt as to allow actual criminals to run for the highest office, there is something severely wrong. The hoi polloi, unwashed masses, etc are becoming politically conscious, but it's too late. We've all traded our freedom and privacy for fleeting digital experiences that ultimately have no meaning. We all chose this path collectively when we chose not to speak up for what is good and just. But hey, it's all relative anyway, right? In the end, the 21st century will be marked by nihilism and cynicism.

dharma1 10y ago

Yeah, I wouldn't, if I was Snowden. http://grapevine.is/news/2014/12/21/mfik-urges-investigation-of-icelands-role-in-cia-torture/ http://grapevine.is/news/2014/12/21/mfik-urges-investigation... Having said that, we don't really know on what terms Snowden is enjoying impunity in Russia. I doubt it has come as a free lunch.

poshli 10y ago

The PP is a fringe radical party that if they somehow become the majority party in Iceland, they're not going to retain it for very long. I would not recommend that famous dissidents like Snowden move there immediately. I like visiting Iceland too, the few Icelanders I know can't wait to move though. The winter weather and high price of everything is a bit of a drag. I am not an expert on Iceland but I have read that it's really controlled by interests behind the two main industries of fishing and smelting. Iceland is really pushing tourism these days, since flights to Iceland are incredibly cheap. I recommend reading The Grapevine http://grapevine.is/ http://grapevine.is/

belorn 10y ago
PP is a new party, but is it fringe and radical? Using social-liberal political philosophy[1] to focus on issues arriving from the digital Revolution[2], it seem like a very similar party to the green party but with a different focal point. We still have political parties today that focus on questions that arrived from by the industrial revolution. Unless we want to just delegate the digital revolution as a minor footnote in society, it might be time to view the changes in society as a reason to look at government and ask if it too should change. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism 2: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Revolution https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Revolution
Broken_Hippo 10y ago
I would guess that it isn't so much the winter weather and the price of goods that is making folks want to leave: I'm in Norway, which traditionally has expensive goods and bad weather. Everyone complains about their weather, but from my experience, the locals don't find it to be all that detrimental to life - I've had to learn to dress better for the weather and stuff like that. (of course, I don't know how strong the icelandic currency is at the moment, so that could be an issue for buying those goods). The second one - that it is really controlled by interests behind the two main industries - is likely much more key. Having a small island country with only two main industries makes it so that folks don't have as much opportunity as they would in mainland Europe or Canada. Not only that, but one of the main industries - fishing - can be rough work in itself. The place being an island also prevents some of the options for avoiding the high prices for goods: Here I can take a (free!) bus just over the Swedish border and buy things more cheaply, but they'd have to take a flight somewhere.

Grue3 10y ago

It's extremely naive to think that Snowden would move somewhere out of Russia. It's very obvious why he went there in the first place.

ionised 10y ago
> It's very obvious why he went there in the first place. Please enlighten us.
gribbly 10y ago
He went there because it was the safest route to Equador, once in Moscow, the US state department cancelled his passport. And just to drive home the dire situation he is in, when rumours were spread of Snowden being aboard the Bolivian president's plane headed for latin america, the US pressured european countries to deny airspace and have it directed to Austria where it was searched.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]

gregman1 10y ago

So you have no idea what is Gluggaveður then=)