6 ms·

Once again, billions of euros are put into use for what is essentially scientific curiosity instead of trying to solve the very real problems Europe is facing.

by LunaSea 10y ago

Once again, billions of euros are put into use for what is essentially scientific curiosity instead of trying to solve the very real problems Europe is facing. I love astronomy and space exploration but the amounts of money wasted into it rather than other problems with a high priority is staggering.

pavlov 10y ago
The EU has a population of over 500 million. For a program like this (assuming it's all from public funds), each citizen paid on average less than a cup of coffee costs at Starbucks. It's real money, but what pressing pan-European problem could you really solve with such a tiny budget?
- LunaSea 10y ago
  Look at the economical situation of countries like Greece and Spain. That would be one starting point.
  - maxander 10y ago
    According to the easily-found stats on Wikipedia [1,2], the MRO cost $720 million, whereas the Greek bailout given in 2010 (alone) was €110 ($119) billion. Notice the "m" in the first and the "b" in the second- your "starting point" is orders of magnitude beyond the resources we're talking about here. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mars_Reconnaissance_Orbiter https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mars_Reconnaissance_Orbiter [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_government-debt_crisis#2010_revelations_and_IMF_bailout https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_government-debt_crisis#2...
    - Symbiote 10y ago
      Indeed, the entire ESA budget for this year is €5.2 billion, of which a third is Earth observation satellites. http://www.esa.int/spaceinimages/Images/2016/01/ESA_budget_2016_by_domain http://www.esa.int/spaceinimages/Images/2016/01/ESA_budget_2...
      - elkos 10y ago
        And as a Greek I see that day by day we are taking advantage more and more the data available from EO satellites. You need lots of data to restart the economy.
  - JorgeGT 10y ago
    Spaniard here, the lander and the upcoming rover feature different instrumentation developed in Spain, something which has allowed extra funding for advancements in research and manufacturing capabilities, space-worthiness certification, etc. for our institutes, universities, and companies. This experience both in term of facilities and human resources will allow us to better compete in the market of space application and other high-tech fields, which is exactly what our country needs.
  - CamperBob2 10y ago
    (Shrug) Send the money to Greece, or bury it in a crater on Mars. What's the difference?
jellicle 10y ago
Yeah! When has exploring ever benefited anyone! No more exploration! The mission cost the citizens of Europe and Russia a bit over 1 Euro per person.
- LunaSea 10y ago
  And how much return did the citizens of Europe and Russia get for this investment?
  - elsonrodriguez 10y ago
    A better question is this: How much return did King Henry VII get from Columbus's expeditions? The answer is nothing, because he rejected Columbus's request to fund his fleet.
  - TeMPOraL 10y ago
    The same if not more. The way ESA operates, each Euro paid by a member country is supposed to come back to that country's economy via ESA contracts.
analogmemory 10y ago
The amount of money we waste on military expenditures is staggering compared to the amount we spend on scientific exploration.
posterboy 10y ago
Given your name, this opinion seems quite surprising.
shuntress 10y ago
It's not wasted. This is important.
CamperBob2 10y ago
I'm with you, to some extent. As a libertarian-minded person, I wish there were a way you could opt out of funding space exploration missions and other expensive projects that you might not agree with. If there were, I might be able to avail myself of the same choices when it comes to funding things that I disagree with, such as massive social engineering projects and trillion-dollar wars of choice. But as a flawed, selfish person, I also wish there were a way to make sure that you and your descendants never see any benefits from the research you thought wasn't worthwhile.
lifeformed 10y ago
Money can be spent on more than one thing at a time. This is a drop in the bucket compared to other "wastes".

by LunaSea 10y ago

pavlov 10y ago

The EU has a population of over 500 million. For a program like this (assuming it's all from public funds), each citizen paid on average less than a cup of coffee costs at Starbucks. It's real money, but what pressing pan-European problem could you really solve with such a tiny budget?

LunaSea 10y ago
Look at the economical situation of countries like Greece and Spain. That would be one starting point.
- maxander 10y ago
  According to the easily-found stats on Wikipedia [1,2], the MRO cost $720 million, whereas the Greek bailout given in 2010 (alone) was €110 ($119) billion. Notice the "m" in the first and the "b" in the second- your "starting point" is orders of magnitude beyond the resources we're talking about here. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mars_Reconnaissance_Orbiter https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mars_Reconnaissance_Orbiter [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_government-debt_crisis#2010_revelations_and_IMF_bailout https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_government-debt_crisis#2...
  - Symbiote 10y ago
    Indeed, the entire ESA budget for this year is €5.2 billion, of which a third is Earth observation satellites. http://www.esa.int/spaceinimages/Images/2016/01/ESA_budget_2016_by_domain http://www.esa.int/spaceinimages/Images/2016/01/ESA_budget_2...
    - elkos 10y ago
      And as a Greek I see that day by day we are taking advantage more and more the data available from EO satellites. You need lots of data to restart the economy.
- JorgeGT 10y ago
  Spaniard here, the lander and the upcoming rover feature different instrumentation developed in Spain, something which has allowed extra funding for advancements in research and manufacturing capabilities, space-worthiness certification, etc. for our institutes, universities, and companies. This experience both in term of facilities and human resources will allow us to better compete in the market of space application and other high-tech fields, which is exactly what our country needs.
- CamperBob2 10y ago
  (Shrug) Send the money to Greece, or bury it in a crater on Mars. What's the difference?

jellicle 10y ago

Yeah! When has exploring ever benefited anyone! No more exploration! The mission cost the citizens of Europe and Russia a bit over 1 Euro per person.

LunaSea 10y ago
And how much return did the citizens of Europe and Russia get for this investment?
- elsonrodriguez 10y ago
  A better question is this: How much return did King Henry VII get from Columbus's expeditions? The answer is nothing, because he rejected Columbus's request to fund his fleet.
- TeMPOraL 10y ago
  The same if not more. The way ESA operates, each Euro paid by a member country is supposed to come back to that country's economy via ESA contracts.

analogmemory 10y ago

The amount of money we waste on military expenditures is staggering compared to the amount we spend on scientific exploration.

posterboy 10y ago

Given your name, this opinion seems quite surprising.

shuntress 10y ago

It's not wasted. This is important.

CamperBob2 10y ago

I'm with you, to some extent. As a libertarian-minded person, I wish there were a way you could opt out of funding space exploration missions and other expensive projects that you might not agree with. If there were, I might be able to avail myself of the same choices when it comes to funding things that I disagree with, such as massive social engineering projects and trillion-dollar wars of choice. But as a flawed, selfish person, I also wish there were a way to make sure that you and your descendants never see any benefits from the research you thought wasn't worthwhile.

lifeformed 10y ago

Money can be spent on more than one thing at a time. This is a drop in the bucket compared to other "wastes".