4 ms·

As an outsider to Switzerland, I'd say the Swiss see quality-of-life (including things like education, transportation) as a national security issue, as a way to

by niftich 10y ago

As an outsider to Switzerland, I'd say the Swiss see quality-of-life (including things like education, transportation) as a national security issue, as a way to remain competitive and relevant in a globalized world where most people can underbid them, and therefore they invest strongly in projects that promote an educated, happy, productive, globally competitive populace. The Alpine tunnels and motorways are a part of this, as they ensure that Switzerland will remain an attractive option for cross-EU freight (instead of going around) but so are more local initiatives that improve conditions in the cities and cantons. EDIT: In many ways, the same applies to Japan. Meanwhile SF feels no such pressure. Plenty of people (and companies) are all-too willing to move there regardless. If/when at some point SF experiences a decline, these skipped investments will begin to be sorely missed.

m_mueller 10y ago
I think you may have a point, although as a resident for a combined ~25y I tend to have less rose tinted glasses about Swiss government. Here's my take on it though: Swiss people do have comparatively high trust in their government. Not because they like the people sitting there, not because they are deemed very competent (in fact Swiss governments are almost by-design boring and just cogs in a machine), but: We feel safe in knowing that if they go just moderately crazy they can be shut down by popular vote within months. The social safety net is another huge factor I think, and probably a bigger one than the citizen rights: There's lots of comfort in knowing that if all goes wrong, you still have a comfortable apartment, your medical bills are covered and you can still send your kids to be best schools in the country - basically all that happens is that you can't take any vacations abroad and you can't go and buy expensive toys you don't need. This makes people much more relaxed, which in turn is often necessary when working together on big projects - if everyone is just in constant ass-covering-defense-mode, things like these will just either never happen or the cost will go through the roof. The thing is though, the US was by far the best nation at this just 50 years ago. The interstate system, the moon landing, Bell Labs, Xerox Parc, MIT... the US is still basically running on top of these efforts from back then. Was it just Reaganism that destroyed it, with later democratic presidents asleep at the wheel? (e.g. Bill Clinton pushed through and signed the money-for-work social program, destroying the old safety net)
- jessaustin 10y ago
  ...if everyone is just in constant ass-covering-defense-mode, things like these will just either never happen or the cost will go through the roof. This is basically every USA public project, and it forms a vicious circle. Because some highway was built some time with an inadequately-compacted roadbed, highway inspectors have to sign off on the compaction of every quarter-mile of roadbed. Because highway inspectors can never be fired, they all eventually succumb to the "inspect from the pickup truck" method. Because inspectors are nominally responsible for quality control, no road builder can ever be held accountable for inadequately compacted roadbed. The result is that vehicles with inadequate dampening often leave the road surface entirely at e.g. each end of every interstate bridge. The thing is though, the US was by far the best nation at this just 50 years ago. The interstate system, the moon landing, Bell Labs, Xerox Parc, MIT... the US is still basically running on top of these efforts from back then. These projects were completed by the Greatest generation, managed without pity by the Lost generation. When we again have generations so well prepared by their formative experiences to work as they did, perhaps we'll have more successful giant centralizing projects like that. If world wars are the price of such abilities, one might rather we did without.

by niftich 10y ago

m_mueller 10y ago

I think you may have a point, although as a resident for a combined ~25y I tend to have less rose tinted glasses about Swiss government. Here's my take on it though: Swiss people do have comparatively high trust in their government. Not because they like the people sitting there, not because they are deemed very competent (in fact Swiss governments are almost by-design boring and just cogs in a machine), but: We feel safe in knowing that if they go just moderately crazy they can be shut down by popular vote within months. The social safety net is another huge factor I think, and probably a bigger one than the citizen rights: There's lots of comfort in knowing that if all goes wrong, you still have a comfortable apartment, your medical bills are covered and you can still send your kids to be best schools in the country - basically all that happens is that you can't take any vacations abroad and you can't go and buy expensive toys you don't need. This makes people much more relaxed, which in turn is often necessary when working together on big projects - if everyone is just in constant ass-covering-defense-mode, things like these will just either never happen or the cost will go through the roof. The thing is though, the US was by far the best nation at this just 50 years ago. The interstate system, the moon landing, Bell Labs, Xerox Parc, MIT... the US is still basically running on top of these efforts from back then. Was it just Reaganism that destroyed it, with later democratic presidents asleep at the wheel? (e.g. Bill Clinton pushed through and signed the money-for-work social program, destroying the old safety net)

jessaustin 10y ago
...if everyone is just in constant ass-covering-defense-mode, things like these will just either never happen or the cost will go through the roof. This is basically every USA public project, and it forms a vicious circle. Because some highway was built some time with an inadequately-compacted roadbed, highway inspectors have to sign off on the compaction of every quarter-mile of roadbed. Because highway inspectors can never be fired, they all eventually succumb to the "inspect from the pickup truck" method. Because inspectors are nominally responsible for quality control, no road builder can ever be held accountable for inadequately compacted roadbed. The result is that vehicles with inadequate dampening often leave the road surface entirely at e.g. each end of every interstate bridge. The thing is though, the US was by far the best nation at this just 50 years ago. The interstate system, the moon landing, Bell Labs, Xerox Parc, MIT... the US is still basically running on top of these efforts from back then. These projects were completed by the Greatest generation, managed without pity by the Lost generation. When we again have generations so well prepared by their formative experiences to work as they did, perhaps we'll have more successful giant centralizing projects like that. If world wars are the price of such abilities, one might rather we did without.