9 ms·

I'd like to see a self-driving car navigate London's narrow streets with cars both sides and the negotiation that goes on between drivers about who goes first.

I'd like to see a self-driving car navigate London's narrow streets with cars both sides and the negotiation that goes on between drivers about who goes first. I'm impressed with this self-driving on California's spacious streets in perfect weather. I'll be really impressed when I see a self-driving car go down a London street in pouring rain, realize it needs to allow someone to come from the other direction and reverses and moves to the left to allow them through.

cscurmudgeon 10y ago
or any street in India.
EastLondonCoder 10y ago
You may be able to see this next year, volvo is planning a trial: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/apr/27/volvo-test-self-driving-cars-london-2017 https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/apr/27/volvo-tes...
vadym909 10y ago
Maybe it will have technology (GPS, Live Traffic, Cameras) to not go on that street until it is good to do so.
- OJFord 10y ago
  > Maybe it will have technology to not go on that street until it is good to do so. Have you driven in London? (Or other comparably busy and narrow city - even NYC at least has 'American-width' roads.) It's not technology that's required, barring perhaps flying car technology. If every way is busy, you can't just wait eternally, you have to communicate with other drivers as parent commenter said, maybe let a couple of people go, and then realise when you just need to go for it and 'force' someone to wait for you if they're not otherwise going to. It will be really awesome to see a car do that safely and autonomously. There'll come a time, perhaps, when two cars are flashing their headlights at each other to communicate, for no real reason other than "that's how human-driven cars did it in the old days"!
pyb 10y ago
I'd also like to see it navigate single track lanes in the English countryside.
- gambiting 10y ago
  I've been driving on a track like this few weeks ago, where grass and branches were sticking out on the road, any the collision prevention assist on my car was freaking out, because it was sensing an immediate collision from all of its sensors. Not to mention that there was nowhere for two vehicle to pass, if I met someone else either I or him would have to reverse a significant distance.
georgespencer 10y ago
These are problems which are actually improved as more cars move to autonomous driving. A sensible government would mandate that manufacturers must upload anonymised data about each car in real time, which would effectively allow for cross-talk between cars. This could enable automatic remedies to the above situations (car X tells car Y "I've got more room behind me, let me reverse), but also prevent them in the first place: car X might pull over because it knows car Y is traversing that street. It would also help to prevent traffic jams which would be a nice orthogonal benefit.)
- dyarosla 10y ago
  I see this pro cross-talk argument all the time... but wouldn't that leave open a big vulnerability for bad actors to send false data between cars and, if they should choose to, control multiple vehicles and cause collisions?
  - freehunter 10y ago
    Also traffic would grind to a halt if the power went out on that block.
  - robotresearcher 10y ago
    Yes. So should we not do it? Maybe the benefits outweigh the risks. Like almost every engineering decision ever, it's a trade off.
  - leecb 10y ago
    If cars upload their data, as well as data about other cars detected in their environment (e.g. positions of other detected cars), we could detect the suppliers of false or incorrect data by comparing data from multiple cars in each situation. It's not perfect, but could be a step in the right direction.
    - uw_rob 10y ago
      With this plan, couldn't the attacker just fake n cars, and thus your car would be determined to be the one that is uploading false information?
CountHackulus 10y ago
I agree, it would be interesting to see. I'd also like to see it handle driving in both a heavy snow winter, like Calgary, and also a muddy brown snow winter, like in Ottawa. I feel like for a long time self driving cars won't be able to handle unplowed streets and will have to get the human to do anything truly difficult.
- brandon272 10y ago
  One issue with self driving cars in snow climates, at least in the area I live in, is that in addition to the issues that come with snow covered roads in the winter, the painted lines are often mostly or completely faded come spring and are not fully repainted until months after the snow has melted.
arethuza 10y ago
The situation I'm keen to see is how self driving cars deal with single track roads with passing spaces (which are pretty common in the wilder parts of the UK, e.g. Scottish Highlands) - if there is a conflict the general rule used by locals is that the car that can most easily reverse back to a parking space does so. NB I'm sure "proper" behaviour can be programmed - I'm just keen to see it! (And who waives if it is a self driving car?)

cscurmudgeon 10y ago

or any street in India.

EastLondonCoder 10y ago

You may be able to see this next year, volvo is planning a trial: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/apr/27/volvo-test-self-driving-cars-london-2017 https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/apr/27/volvo-tes...

vadym909 10y ago

Maybe it will have technology (GPS, Live Traffic, Cameras) to not go on that street until it is good to do so.

OJFord 10y ago
> Maybe it will have technology to not go on that street until it is good to do so. Have you driven in London? (Or other comparably busy and narrow city - even NYC at least has 'American-width' roads.) It's not technology that's required, barring perhaps flying car technology. If every way is busy, you can't just wait eternally, you have to communicate with other drivers as parent commenter said, maybe let a couple of people go, and then realise when you just need to go for it and 'force' someone to wait for you if they're not otherwise going to. It will be really awesome to see a car do that safely and autonomously. There'll come a time, perhaps, when two cars are flashing their headlights at each other to communicate, for no real reason other than "that's how human-driven cars did it in the old days"!

pyb 10y ago

I'd also like to see it navigate single track lanes in the English countryside.

gambiting 10y ago
I've been driving on a track like this few weeks ago, where grass and branches were sticking out on the road, any the collision prevention assist on my car was freaking out, because it was sensing an immediate collision from all of its sensors. Not to mention that there was nowhere for two vehicle to pass, if I met someone else either I or him would have to reverse a significant distance.

georgespencer 10y ago

These are problems which are actually improved as more cars move to autonomous driving. A sensible government would mandate that manufacturers must upload anonymised data about each car in real time, which would effectively allow for cross-talk between cars. This could enable automatic remedies to the above situations (car X tells car Y "I've got more room behind me, let me reverse), but also prevent them in the first place: car X might pull over because it knows car Y is traversing that street. It would also help to prevent traffic jams which would be a nice orthogonal benefit.)

dyarosla 10y ago
I see this pro cross-talk argument all the time... but wouldn't that leave open a big vulnerability for bad actors to send false data between cars and, if they should choose to, control multiple vehicles and cause collisions?
- freehunter 10y ago
  Also traffic would grind to a halt if the power went out on that block.
- robotresearcher 10y ago
  Yes. So should we not do it? Maybe the benefits outweigh the risks. Like almost every engineering decision ever, it's a trade off.
- leecb 10y ago
  If cars upload their data, as well as data about other cars detected in their environment (e.g. positions of other detected cars), we could detect the suppliers of false or incorrect data by comparing data from multiple cars in each situation. It's not perfect, but could be a step in the right direction.
  - uw_rob 10y ago
    With this plan, couldn't the attacker just fake n cars, and thus your car would be determined to be the one that is uploading false information?

CountHackulus 10y ago

I agree, it would be interesting to see. I'd also like to see it handle driving in both a heavy snow winter, like Calgary, and also a muddy brown snow winter, like in Ottawa. I feel like for a long time self driving cars won't be able to handle unplowed streets and will have to get the human to do anything truly difficult.

brandon272 10y ago
One issue with self driving cars in snow climates, at least in the area I live in, is that in addition to the issues that come with snow covered roads in the winter, the painted lines are often mostly or completely faded come spring and are not fully repainted until months after the snow has melted.

arethuza 10y ago

The situation I'm keen to see is how self driving cars deal with single track roads with passing spaces (which are pretty common in the wilder parts of the UK, e.g. Scottish Highlands) - if there is a conflict the general rule used by locals is that the car that can most easily reverse back to a parking space does so. NB I'm sure "proper" behaviour can be programmed - I'm just keen to see it! (And who waives if it is a self driving car?)