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I think the "golden age" of online fraud is coming to an end quickly. I've posted quite heavily on Stripe and fraud threads on HN previously if you want to read
by rwmurrayVT 10y ago
I think the "golden age" of online fraud is coming to an end quickly. I've posted quite heavily on Stripe and fraud threads on HN previously if you want to read my comment history.
This is a big step for Stripe. I've often asked why they didn't have an integration with MaxMind or SiftScience already set up. They've been building their own behind-the-scenes the entire time! This feature is fantastic if you are a merchant and want to avoid fraud.
To me, the more interesting side of online credit card fraud is the merchant/payment processor side. Stripe has a cult-like following in the fraud world because it's known as the the easiest target. They make it so easy to sign up and process transactions compared to other services like Authorize.net/BrainTree/etc. They've shed this label recently, in part because the biggest forum thread discussing it was closed. The other reason was because it became so much more difficult. With this release, I think it's simply because they could identify accounts with high numbers of suspected fraudulent transactions. All the fraudsters were used to just signing up, running charges on their webstore with sock5, and waiting 2 days for bank transfers. Now Stripe can identify those transactions well in advance and assign each account a risk score. Previously, Stripe had to identify the account risk by sales volume, chargebacks, bank account provider, sign up IP, and every one's favourite privacy invader IESnare.
Fraudster's have one last shining hope against Stripe. Passing their card data to Stripe via API, instead of Stripe.JS/Checkout. Radar only works with Stripe.JS/Checkout. Setting up your own web server to pass card information prevents them from ever seeing any IP address except the web server. All you have to do to get them to be okay with this is to turn over a PCI self-compliance form. Rumour on the internet has it that there's a pre-built web application specifically for charging Stripe accounts via API.
I'm still looking for a job in fraud prevention friends at Stripe :D
- Artemis2 10y agoIs it something different from the /tokens endpoint? Do they have any protection against pushing your data directly that way?
- rwmurrayVT 10y agoprivate message me or email me at my username @vt.edu. Edit: I lied my email is rwmurray @ [vt.edu].
- undefined0 10y agoUsing Spreedy to act as a 'white' proxy to their API would make it an even harder job for Stripe to detect the fraudsters. What would be your solution to the problem?
- rwmurrayVT 10y agoIt seems Spreedy is the solution I'm talking about. I can't say with absolute certainty. Their website says it uses api.stripe.com, which is great. Basically, any code that passes directly to Stripe's API instead of to Stripe.JS/Checkout. If you strip away the "buyer's" IP then a lot of their ability to detect fraudulent transactions goes away. They still have account based limits and other methods, but my personal opinion is the anecdotal increase in difficulty of creating fraudulent Stripe accounts is due to Radar based detection.
- gruez 10y ago>in part because the biggest forum thread discussing it was closed what was that forum?
- rwmurrayVT 10y agoAlphaBay. It had a 200+ page thread on Stripe and methods for creating Stripe accounts to process fraudulent payments. I feel confident saying this time 1 year ago they were easily pushing 500k-1m USD in transactions a month. There were several users who posted screen shots of single accounts reaching 50k-180k. Threads deleted, but only to stop newbies and methods from leaking out to public readers like myself.