4 ms·

I'm not sure if that's it. Google employees are worth much more per-capita than most bank employees - and banks stay in the city - due to the networking (and p

I'm not sure if that's it. Google employees are worth much more per-capita than most bank employees - and banks stay in the city - due to the networking (and prestige?) nature of the industry. I think it also has to do with isolation and creating culture. Urban areas have a lot of distractions, and individuality is encouraged. There is 'not that much to do' in Palo Alto, at least, compared to the city ... people live in pretty normal homes, doing pretty normal things in the little time they have outside of work. Also consider: how many truly innovative companies were ever created in the city and grew to be quite large? I mean - 'cost' would be a factor, but why is it almost never the case? If you need 10K employees, you need a lot of 'regular folks' - grinders, who show up every day - and who aren't the fleeting, company-hopping, types. Obviously it's just a thought. A lot of great Universities seem to be out in nowhere-land as well. I think there's something to be said for being out of the social centrifuge.

selectiveshift 10y ago
>Also consider: how many truly innovative companies were ever created in the city and grew to be quite large? Amazon is one example.
- mc32 10y ago
  Yet, when they need distribution centers --where do they go for real-estate? Where do AMZN, GOOG, MSFT, etc., go for their DCs? That's right, not in downtown.
  - selectiveshift 10y ago
    Of course they don't put them downtown. The logistics would be a nightmare (especially for distribution centers).
    - mc32 10y ago
      You're right. My point is a lot of innovation goes into data centers (as well as distribution centers) and necessarily it's not downtown.
      - user5994461 10y ago
        There was another topic on HN talking about these datacenters. Less than 50 people work in a typical datacenters. All the R&D to make the datacenter is done outside of it, in R&D centers.
      - dgemm 10y ago
        To be fair, the discussion is about corporate offices and not DCs. Amazon may build DCs out of town for servers but they build skyscrapers downtown for people.
- jomamaxx 10y ago
  Sure - but it's rare. Think about all the big companies you know. None of them - except banks/insurance are really in the city. Look at Twitter, they almost got there, now dwindling. I've worked at a few startups, and visited a zillion. Though Goog/FB do have a cool/trendy vibe ... I can't help but feel that most of them wouldn't fit city life very well. I knew some Engs. in the Valley - super smart dudes who never heard of ISIS. I mean, man. They don't even watch the news. Work -> kids -> geeky projects -> riding. That's it. I don't blame them at all ... But I really do think that the culture out in the burbs is more amenable to 'Empire Building' and getting loyal, normal, predictable folks. BTW - banks have a lot of job hoppers - because their career paths are so formalized, it's not a big deal for people to hope from one building to the next. Some of the systems are identical, if not entirely the cultures. And many forms of banking are intensely social, which is not like tech. I also think most banking types tend to be 'upper urban' type people - or at least aspire to that. Tech people are more low key about things. Anyhow, just my observation.
mc32 10y ago
There is a lot to digest there... Banks can be in the 'burbs, but when most were incorporated, it was beneficial to be next to the exchanges and to government (both the fed office and the feds, etc.) but some have moved to Raleigh or RTP... And, for some a big skyscraper = prestige. >There is 'not that much to do' in Palo Alto For people without kids this makes a difference --it makes a difference to the newly independent, the ones in fraternities and sororities, they want to continue their partying. For people with kids, even if they live in the city, most nights are spent at home -unless they are one of those "power" people who must "rub elbows". >how many truly innovative companies were ever created in the city I think that's just a coincidence. As you point out, lots of universities are in the burbs (Cheap land for a nice campus and dorms) and a nice place to start on your idea with your mates/pals/etc. In addition, till recently, companies had to "build things" physical things and it's easier to build those things where there was land. There is a reason Toyota isn't in the center of Tokyo. But nowadays where the product is non-physical, we do see some innovative companies begin in expensive cities. >A lot of great Universities seem to be out in nowhere-land as well True, but there is the exception of Boston.
- cguess 10y ago
  >True, but there is the exception of Boston. Or NYU, Columbia, University of Chicago, UCLA, King's College, London School of Economics, the Sorbonne
eeZah7Ux 10y ago
> isolation and creating culture Pick one. "culture" develops when different ideas meet. Unless you mean corporate cargo-culting and echo chambers.

selectiveshift 10y ago

>Also consider: how many truly innovative companies were ever created in the city and grew to be quite large? Amazon is one example.

mc32 10y ago
Yet, when they need distribution centers --where do they go for real-estate? Where do AMZN, GOOG, MSFT, etc., go for their DCs? That's right, not in downtown.
- selectiveshift 10y ago
  Of course they don't put them downtown. The logistics would be a nightmare (especially for distribution centers).
  - mc32 10y ago
    You're right. My point is a lot of innovation goes into data centers (as well as distribution centers) and necessarily it's not downtown.
    - user5994461 10y ago
      There was another topic on HN talking about these datacenters. Less than 50 people work in a typical datacenters. All the R&D to make the datacenter is done outside of it, in R&D centers.
    - dgemm 10y ago
      To be fair, the discussion is about corporate offices and not DCs. Amazon may build DCs out of town for servers but they build skyscrapers downtown for people.
jomamaxx 10y ago
Sure - but it's rare. Think about all the big companies you know. None of them - except banks/insurance are really in the city. Look at Twitter, they almost got there, now dwindling. I've worked at a few startups, and visited a zillion. Though Goog/FB do have a cool/trendy vibe ... I can't help but feel that most of them wouldn't fit city life very well. I knew some Engs. in the Valley - super smart dudes who never heard of ISIS. I mean, man. They don't even watch the news. Work -> kids -> geeky projects -> riding. That's it. I don't blame them at all ... But I really do think that the culture out in the burbs is more amenable to 'Empire Building' and getting loyal, normal, predictable folks. BTW - banks have a lot of job hoppers - because their career paths are so formalized, it's not a big deal for people to hope from one building to the next. Some of the systems are identical, if not entirely the cultures. And many forms of banking are intensely social, which is not like tech. I also think most banking types tend to be 'upper urban' type people - or at least aspire to that. Tech people are more low key about things. Anyhow, just my observation.

mc32 10y ago

There is a lot to digest there... Banks can be in the 'burbs, but when most were incorporated, it was beneficial to be next to the exchanges and to government (both the fed office and the feds, etc.) but some have moved to Raleigh or RTP... And, for some a big skyscraper = prestige. >There is 'not that much to do' in Palo Alto For people without kids this makes a difference --it makes a difference to the newly independent, the ones in fraternities and sororities, they want to continue their partying. For people with kids, even if they live in the city, most nights are spent at home -unless they are one of those "power" people who must "rub elbows". >how many truly innovative companies were ever created in the city I think that's just a coincidence. As you point out, lots of universities are in the burbs (Cheap land for a nice campus and dorms) and a nice place to start on your idea with your mates/pals/etc. In addition, till recently, companies had to "build things" physical things and it's easier to build those things where there was land. There is a reason Toyota isn't in the center of Tokyo. But nowadays where the product is non-physical, we do see some innovative companies begin in expensive cities. >A lot of great Universities seem to be out in nowhere-land as well True, but there is the exception of Boston.

cguess 10y ago
>True, but there is the exception of Boston. Or NYU, Columbia, University of Chicago, UCLA, King's College, London School of Economics, the Sorbonne

eeZah7Ux 10y ago

> isolation and creating culture Pick one. "culture" develops when different ideas meet. Unless you mean corporate cargo-culting and echo chambers.