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On the one hand we have a reputable media company reporting quotes from reputable sources, and on the other we have WikiLeaks (with a very well documented agend

by dntrkv 10y ago

On the one hand we have a reputable media company reporting quotes from reputable sources, and on the other we have WikiLeaks (with a very well documented agenda) claiming the exact opposite from an anonymous source. The New York Times and The State Department are both putting their reputation (however much that means to you) on the line with their quotes, whereas WikiLeaks and its anonymous source, aren't putting anything on the line since a large part of their business model depends on making claims that can only be proven in their favor, but never in reverse. Example, this claim about who is responsible for cutting Assange's internet access. Let's say the US did not cut his internet. There is absolutely nothing The State Department can say to make WikiLeaks supporters believe them. Whereas, anything WikiLeaks says about the US government will be eaten up by their supporters since the only people that can provide evidence to the contrary, WikiLeaks supporters don't trust. It's the same approach taken by Alex Jones (They want to take your guns, they want to put you in fema camps, etc...), Trump (A lot of people are saying...) Oh and btw, I'm not saying you should just blindly believe what the government tells you, but until any actual evidence is provided to support another explanation, there is no reason to assume it is true. Bonus hypocritical Trump tweet: https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump/status/781838706030313472 https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump/status/78183870603031347...

drzaiusapelord 10y ago
>anything WikiLeaks says about the US government will be eaten up by their supporters It used to be a saying that geeks can't do politics. And now after what I've seen of years of slashdot, digg, Reddit, and HN I think its fair to say that saying is true. The problem I see is that people who think they're smart think they must automatically be immune to propaganda, bias, etc because, well, they're so smart. I find the techie personality to be unusually vulnerable to propaganda and conspiracy theories. I think this type of thinking gives simple answers and black and white thinking that are intellectually satisfying and dismiss the incredible complexity of human interactions. Its very easy to just eat up anti-US college identity politics and make the US be the devil in all things. Its simple and is emotionally satisfying. The problem is that its also incorrect, especially when your "good guys" are Russia, China, and Iran.
- ccallebs 10y ago
  I agree with you 100%. Most political talking points on sites like Reddit (and even HN) are just platitudes. The problem is they've been repeated so often that even questioning something is ground for a public tar and feathering. We cannot have any sort of meaningful dialog when the opposition on both sides is painted into a caricature. George W. Bush had an amazing quote during the memorial service for the fallen Dallas PD officers. Paraphrasing but: "We judge other groups by their worst and ourselves by our intentions"
freshhawk 10y ago
> The New York Times and The State Department are both putting their reputation (however much that means to you) on the line with their quotes I think the disconnect here is just how much weight you put on this statement here. For a significant number of people a lot of recent news has severely damaged the reputations of these institutions as well as shown that their reputations really wouldn't be impacted by their claims being shown to be false.

by dntrkv 10y ago

drzaiusapelord 10y ago

>anything WikiLeaks says about the US government will be eaten up by their supporters It used to be a saying that geeks can't do politics. And now after what I've seen of years of slashdot, digg, Reddit, and HN I think its fair to say that saying is true. The problem I see is that people who think they're smart think they must automatically be immune to propaganda, bias, etc because, well, they're so smart. I find the techie personality to be unusually vulnerable to propaganda and conspiracy theories. I think this type of thinking gives simple answers and black and white thinking that are intellectually satisfying and dismiss the incredible complexity of human interactions. Its very easy to just eat up anti-US college identity politics and make the US be the devil in all things. Its simple and is emotionally satisfying. The problem is that its also incorrect, especially when your "good guys" are Russia, China, and Iran.

ccallebs 10y ago
I agree with you 100%. Most political talking points on sites like Reddit (and even HN) are just platitudes. The problem is they've been repeated so often that even questioning something is ground for a public tar and feathering. We cannot have any sort of meaningful dialog when the opposition on both sides is painted into a caricature. George W. Bush had an amazing quote during the memorial service for the fallen Dallas PD officers. Paraphrasing but: "We judge other groups by their worst and ourselves by our intentions"

freshhawk 10y ago

> The New York Times and The State Department are both putting their reputation (however much that means to you) on the line with their quotes I think the disconnect here is just how much weight you put on this statement here. For a significant number of people a lot of recent news has severely damaged the reputations of these institutions as well as shown that their reputations really wouldn't be impacted by their claims being shown to be false.