6 ms·

So what is so much better on Linux than Mac? You can use nvm, etc

pimeys 10y ago
The user interface. The package manager that handles everything. Not being locked to Apple's ecosystem, e.g. needing to install Xcode to get your CLI ecosystem working. Not having yearly updates that change everything. Using an open source operating system and not being bound to Apple hardware.
- konart 10y ago
  >Not having yearly updates that change everything Yeah, right. >not being bound to Apple hardware. Not an issue for years already, unless we are talking about some very specific hardware. PS: not trying to advocate for either of systems, worked on both linux (ubuntu, arch, centos) and macOS. Both have their share of pros and cons.
  - adamors 10y ago
    I'm using a Hackintosh for 4 years now. It's definitely not true that one is bound to Apple hardware.
    - mugsie 10y ago
      Well, from a legal perspective you are bound to their hardware. A Hackintosh is a breach of the EULA, and no company should allow one to be used for their development, as it can create a potentially massive liability for them.
      - pjmlp 10y ago
        While true, EULAs aren't valid in many countries, regardless what companies wish for. Having said this, I also don't agree with using Hackintoshs.
      - adamors 10y ago
        AFAIK EULAs are entirely illegal and unenforceable in the EU.
  - sparrish 10y ago
    I would likely go mad if I had to use a Mac keyboard without a 'delete' key. Why did they remove that?
    - pmontra 10y ago
      Yeah, crazy. It's Fn-Backspace to delete. Uncomfortable and no wonder almost no Mac user know about it. Maybe a reason for the gain in popularity of vim? It's X (upcase) to delete forward there.
    - insulanian 10y ago
      I was worried about the keyboard when I was planning to buy a Mac, but it took no time to get used to it and actually like it so much that I now think that having less keys is actually better. Having to press `fn` key in addition to backspace key is not a big deal at all, and I like more `fn` in combination with cursor keys than separate PgUp/PgDn/Home/End keys.
    - konart 10y ago
      Then... don't? It's not like you can't use any other keyboard. Mine is still wrapped in plastic somewhere in a box.
  - pimeys 10y ago
    > >Not having yearly updates that change everything >Yeah, right. Minimal Arch Linux with a minimal desktop and rolling updates. > >not being bound to Apple hardware. >Not an issue for years already, unless we are talking about some very specific hardware. It is an issue, if you have a budget and you want a fast computer for compiling and so on. Right now I'm having a modern 4GHz i7 with 32 gigabytes of ram, a m.2 SSD and two monitors where the other is a 30" IPS. Having the fastest computer in the office is pretty nice, with a price of a macbook and monitor.
    - konart 10y ago
      You can install macOS on almost any modern hardwere these days. That's why it is not an issue >Minimal Arch Linux with a minimal desktop and rolling updates. I switched to Arch after Ubuntu 10.04 (or 10.10, I don't really remember when they brought Unity up). And yes - it's much better in this regard, but you still see an update on their main page from time to time that will tell you this and that about some big changes and instructions to handle this. OSX\macOS didn't have anything like that in years now.
indy 10y ago
Using the same OS that you deploy to
- konart 10y ago
  To be honest - kernel will be the same (some times not though). OS will be most likely different. Better say that environment will be the same, I guess. That being said - as an ex-Linux user (for about 10 years) I see now real reason for this kind of switch. You can have the same (or almost the same) env on you macOS.
  - neverminder 10y ago
    If we take the most popular linux choice for servers and desktop - Ubuntu as an example - that means using identical kernel/packages/libraries for your development and production. You cannot achieve that with MacOS as your dev OS.
    - konart 10y ago
      Desktop - most likely, server - I wouldn't be so sure. Kernel - obviously, as I said earlier. As for packages and libs - Brew + something like pip\rvm\whatever will most likely solve this for you. You won't have the same lib, because it was build for a different env, but the way it works should stay the same. If not - I'd rather consider using different lib. This + docker(or something similar) as someone already mentioned.
    - jawngee 10y ago
      You can with vagrant + parallels/virtual box/vmware.
    - pjmlp 10y ago
      That doesn't matter at all when using programming languages with OS agnostic runtimes[0]. Also, unless IT agrees to put beefy machines under each one's desk, the server is quite different from what developers can use anyway. Finally if there is any issue that really needs testing on the server, that is what remote connections (including remote debugging) are for. [0] We usually develop on Windows and deploy on UNIX.
crdoconnor 10y ago
* Package management isn't a train-wreck (I always have troubles with brew whenever I have to move to a mac that I never have with linux). * There are substantial subtle differences between Mac and Linux that will eventually trip you up when leaping the divide between development and deployment. * The Mac often has ridiculously old versions of tools because of its GPL allergy. But hey, Macs are shiny and popular.
- mugsie 10y ago
  ++. I will say their screens are a step above 90% of other laptops, not that it makes a huge difference when you are reading text.
  - walshemj 10y ago
    so? most development should be done on desktop pcs with dual or triple monitor set ups.
    - mugsie 10y ago
      Yeap, and 90% of mine is - but sometimes you are at a conference, doing something over the weekend, or on a plane, and an external monitor is not possible.
      - walshemj 10y ago
        And your point is? spending the premium for a mac for this use case is a waste of your or the share holders money
        mugsie 10y ago
        not really actually. the 2 systems on offer were similar price range, and there was other factors that pushed towards a mac.
        10y ago
Keyframe 10y ago
Valgrind works most of the time, unlike on Mac. That's a big one in my book.
executesorder66 10y ago
Not having to go through things like this [0] just so that I can use non-ancient versions of GNU utils. [0] http://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/69223/how-to-replace-mac-os-x-utilities-with-gnu-core-utilities#69332 http://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/69223/how-to-replac...
- vonklaus 10y ago
  I like linux, maybe not as hardcore as many users here, but your point is really lost on me. I run a modified version of mathias dotfiles so provisioning is usually simply ./bootstrap.sh. I like the os x desktop better than linux, and while I can see the value of running linux for your development machine, the extra effort of having to download GNU utilitites a single time with a switch/flag really isn't a big enough reason to jump shit on the entire ecosystem to be honest.

The user interface. The package manager that handles everything. Not being locked to Apple's ecosystem, e.g. needing to install Xcode to get your CLI ecosystem working. Not having yearly updates that change everything. Using an open source operating system and not being bound to Apple hardware.

konart 10y ago
>Not having yearly updates that change everything Yeah, right. >not being bound to Apple hardware. Not an issue for years already, unless we are talking about some very specific hardware. PS: not trying to advocate for either of systems, worked on both linux (ubuntu, arch, centos) and macOS. Both have their share of pros and cons.
- adamors 10y ago
  I'm using a Hackintosh for 4 years now. It's definitely not true that one is bound to Apple hardware.
  - mugsie 10y ago
    Well, from a legal perspective you are bound to their hardware. A Hackintosh is a breach of the EULA, and no company should allow one to be used for their development, as it can create a potentially massive liability for them.
    - pjmlp 10y ago
      While true, EULAs aren't valid in many countries, regardless what companies wish for. Having said this, I also don't agree with using Hackintoshs.
    - adamors 10y ago
      AFAIK EULAs are entirely illegal and unenforceable in the EU.
- sparrish 10y ago
  I would likely go mad if I had to use a Mac keyboard without a 'delete' key. Why did they remove that?
  - pmontra 10y ago
    Yeah, crazy. It's Fn-Backspace to delete. Uncomfortable and no wonder almost no Mac user know about it. Maybe a reason for the gain in popularity of vim? It's X (upcase) to delete forward there.
  - insulanian 10y ago
    I was worried about the keyboard when I was planning to buy a Mac, but it took no time to get used to it and actually like it so much that I now think that having less keys is actually better. Having to press `fn` key in addition to backspace key is not a big deal at all, and I like more `fn` in combination with cursor keys than separate PgUp/PgDn/Home/End keys.
  - konart 10y ago
    Then... don't? It's not like you can't use any other keyboard. Mine is still wrapped in plastic somewhere in a box.
- pimeys 10y ago
  > >Not having yearly updates that change everything >Yeah, right. Minimal Arch Linux with a minimal desktop and rolling updates. > >not being bound to Apple hardware. >Not an issue for years already, unless we are talking about some very specific hardware. It is an issue, if you have a budget and you want a fast computer for compiling and so on. Right now I'm having a modern 4GHz i7 with 32 gigabytes of ram, a m.2 SSD and two monitors where the other is a 30" IPS. Having the fastest computer in the office is pretty nice, with a price of a macbook and monitor.
  - konart 10y ago
    You can install macOS on almost any modern hardwere these days. That's why it is not an issue >Minimal Arch Linux with a minimal desktop and rolling updates. I switched to Arch after Ubuntu 10.04 (or 10.10, I don't really remember when they brought Unity up). And yes - it's much better in this regard, but you still see an update on their main page from time to time that will tell you this and that about some big changes and instructions to handle this. OSX\macOS didn't have anything like that in years now.

indy 10y ago

Using the same OS that you deploy to

konart 10y ago
To be honest - kernel will be the same (some times not though). OS will be most likely different. Better say that environment will be the same, I guess. That being said - as an ex-Linux user (for about 10 years) I see now real reason for this kind of switch. You can have the same (or almost the same) env on you macOS.
- neverminder 10y ago
  If we take the most popular linux choice for servers and desktop - Ubuntu as an example - that means using identical kernel/packages/libraries for your development and production. You cannot achieve that with MacOS as your dev OS.
  - konart 10y ago
    Desktop - most likely, server - I wouldn't be so sure. Kernel - obviously, as I said earlier. As for packages and libs - Brew + something like pip\rvm\whatever will most likely solve this for you. You won't have the same lib, because it was build for a different env, but the way it works should stay the same. If not - I'd rather consider using different lib. This + docker(or something similar) as someone already mentioned.
  - jawngee 10y ago
    You can with vagrant + parallels/virtual box/vmware.
  - pjmlp 10y ago
    That doesn't matter at all when using programming languages with OS agnostic runtimes[0]. Also, unless IT agrees to put beefy machines under each one's desk, the server is quite different from what developers can use anyway. Finally if there is any issue that really needs testing on the server, that is what remote connections (including remote debugging) are for. [0] We usually develop on Windows and deploy on UNIX.

crdoconnor 10y ago

* Package management isn't a train-wreck (I always have troubles with brew whenever I have to move to a mac that I never have with linux). * There are substantial subtle differences between Mac and Linux that will eventually trip you up when leaping the divide between development and deployment. * The Mac often has ridiculously old versions of tools because of its GPL allergy. But hey, Macs are shiny and popular.

mugsie 10y ago
++. I will say their screens are a step above 90% of other laptops, not that it makes a huge difference when you are reading text.
- walshemj 10y ago
  so? most development should be done on desktop pcs with dual or triple monitor set ups.
  - mugsie 10y ago
    Yeap, and 90% of mine is - but sometimes you are at a conference, doing something over the weekend, or on a plane, and an external monitor is not possible.
    - walshemj 10y ago
      And your point is? spending the premium for a mac for this use case is a waste of your or the share holders money
      - mugsie 10y ago
        not really actually. the 2 systems on offer were similar price range, and there was other factors that pushed towards a mac.
        10y ago

Keyframe 10y ago

Valgrind works most of the time, unlike on Mac. That's a big one in my book.

executesorder66 10y ago

Not having to go through things like this [0] just so that I can use non-ancient versions of GNU utils. [0] http://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/69223/how-to-replace-mac-os-x-utilities-with-gnu-core-utilities#69332 http://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/69223/how-to-replac...

vonklaus 10y ago
I like linux, maybe not as hardcore as many users here, but your point is really lost on me. I run a modified version of mathias dotfiles so provisioning is usually simply ./bootstrap.sh. I like the os x desktop better than linux, and while I can see the value of running linux for your development machine, the extra effort of having to download GNU utilitites a single time with a switch/flag really isn't a big enough reason to jump shit on the entire ecosystem to be honest.