4 ms·

A whole bunch of plants can kill you, we haven't banned nightshade, most mushrooms, poison ivy, green potatoes lol. Let's ban poison ivy. Let's ban going outs

A whole bunch of plants can kill you, we haven't banned nightshade, most mushrooms, poison ivy, green potatoes lol. Let's ban poison ivy. Let's ban going outside without sunblock on. Let's ban walking around without a bicycle helmet on. Let's have the govt come into my office every two hours and remind me to get up and walk around and stretch. At some point, people have to take care of themselves. How many kratom addicts have you ever had a problem with? And how many problematic interactions with a drunk? We aren't banning alcohol either.

toss1941 10y ago
And there is strong evidence that Kratom curtails alcohol addiction. Kratom is amazing. It has anti-depressive effects that once fully understand I believe will usher in a new and vastly superior wave of anti-depressants. To schedule 1 this plant is beyond insane. Banning it is the bunny brained idea of a lunatic. The DEA is completely out of touch with reality or some special interest is pulling their strings.
- WhitneyLand 10y ago
  Strong evidence? Citations please.
  - GordonS 10y ago
    On mobile now, so can't give examples, but do a search on Google scholar and you really will find plenty evidence there
    - rms 10y ago
      Really? I tried doing this search and can't find much. I'm pretty up on the state of the scientific literature on kratom, because I'm in the industry, curious, and have been actively working at improving the dreadful wikipedia article. There's this case, http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0924933811717618 http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0924933811... , but it's a case of one. There are some cases of simultaneous kratom and alcohol dependence, but that's not the same thing. Even the peer reviewed evidence for kratom working for opiate withdrawal is quite weak, despite boatloads of anecdotal evidence. There are studies in mice and some observational studies, but nothing that meets the standards of an FDA clinical trial. Kratom has just not really been seriously studied. If I'm missing some papers or a body of research, please let me know.
      - GordonS 10y ago
        Sorry, I thought I was replying to a thread about kratom's efficacy on pain, not alcohol dependence. Not sure if I hit reply on the wrong thread or just misread it!

toss1941 10y ago

And there is strong evidence that Kratom curtails alcohol addiction. Kratom is amazing. It has anti-depressive effects that once fully understand I believe will usher in a new and vastly superior wave of anti-depressants. To schedule 1 this plant is beyond insane. Banning it is the bunny brained idea of a lunatic. The DEA is completely out of touch with reality or some special interest is pulling their strings.

WhitneyLand 10y ago
Strong evidence? Citations please.
- GordonS 10y ago
  On mobile now, so can't give examples, but do a search on Google scholar and you really will find plenty evidence there
  - rms 10y ago
    Really? I tried doing this search and can't find much. I'm pretty up on the state of the scientific literature on kratom, because I'm in the industry, curious, and have been actively working at improving the dreadful wikipedia article. There's this case, http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0924933811717618 http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0924933811... , but it's a case of one. There are some cases of simultaneous kratom and alcohol dependence, but that's not the same thing. Even the peer reviewed evidence for kratom working for opiate withdrawal is quite weak, despite boatloads of anecdotal evidence. There are studies in mice and some observational studies, but nothing that meets the standards of an FDA clinical trial. Kratom has just not really been seriously studied. If I'm missing some papers or a body of research, please let me know.
    - GordonS 10y ago
      Sorry, I thought I was replying to a thread about kratom's efficacy on pain, not alcohol dependence. Not sure if I hit reply on the wrong thread or just misread it!