3 ms·

I don't really see how the integration would be any better than what I'm getting already from Emacs: I can already patch the code live, etc, through a REPL, and

I don't really see how the integration would be any better than what I'm getting already from Emacs: I can already patch the code live, etc, through a REPL, and run the code as I develop it. Nightlight is asking me to give up the comfort of Emacs: so what does it get me?

tunaoftheland 10y ago
I am ignorant of SLIME/CIDER (though I think I've used the latter with Clojure). Do they have access to the same memory space as the running application and the ability to interact with live application state? It seem that Nightlight has that as a goal. My (limited) understanding is that SLIME/CIDER run in a separate process from the application, thus requiring IPC back and forth between Emacs and the application runtime.
- qwertyuiop924 10y ago
  That's true, but the practical effect (having access to application internals, interacting with live program state, the ability to connect to a live program and hotpatch it, even if it's running on a remote server (but you'll really want the source files if you're doing that, and you should be sure to upload the new sources/binary to the server you just hotpatched, or you'll be in for a shock when it reboots), and so on) is exactly the same, and they mostly share the same capabilities (AFAICT, Nightlight might have better autocomplete than SLIME/Geiser, but other than that, I can't think of anything).
JaumeGreen 10y ago
> Nightlight is asking me to give up the comfort of Emacs: so what does it get me? Perhaps nothing. But for me it would give me the fact that it's not Emacs. I know that Emacs is considered the one and true way to do lisp, specially common lisp, but, for me, it's the reason I haven't started to do anything in that language. Different people, different needs. It might cater someone else's needs.
- qwertyuiop924 10y ago
  You do raise a good point, but I suspect that other users would ask the same question, s/emacs/$EDITOR/gi, and a few other substitutions for the specific commands and plugins (I'm not familiar enough with other ecosystems to say which ones). And Emacs isn't the only way to do CL, it's just got really good support for all lisps: Paredit and SLIME are still some of the extensions against which all others are judged, with most lisps having a SLIME equivalent mode, give or take. But what's so bad about Emacs?
  - JaumeGreen 10y ago
    > But what's so bad about Emacs? The time you have to devote to learn it. I get that when you are used to it and use it you get that time back, but I haven't had a job where I could use that, and when I had time I was more of a vi person. On can go up so many learning cliffs until he gets tired of that and just yearns for interfaces that are similar to the ones already known or so easy that no learning is necessary to start using them.
    - qwertyuiop924 10y ago
      VIM has at least decent Lisp support, with a version of Paredit, and SLIMV. I don't know if there's any CIDER equivalent for Clojure development, though.

tunaoftheland 10y ago

I am ignorant of SLIME/CIDER (though I think I've used the latter with Clojure). Do they have access to the same memory space as the running application and the ability to interact with live application state? It seem that Nightlight has that as a goal. My (limited) understanding is that SLIME/CIDER run in a separate process from the application, thus requiring IPC back and forth between Emacs and the application runtime.

qwertyuiop924 10y ago
That's true, but the practical effect (having access to application internals, interacting with live program state, the ability to connect to a live program and hotpatch it, even if it's running on a remote server (but you'll really want the source files if you're doing that, and you should be sure to upload the new sources/binary to the server you just hotpatched, or you'll be in for a shock when it reboots), and so on) is exactly the same, and they mostly share the same capabilities (AFAICT, Nightlight might have better autocomplete than SLIME/Geiser, but other than that, I can't think of anything).

JaumeGreen 10y ago

> Nightlight is asking me to give up the comfort of Emacs: so what does it get me? Perhaps nothing. But for me it would give me the fact that it's not Emacs. I know that Emacs is considered the one and true way to do lisp, specially common lisp, but, for me, it's the reason I haven't started to do anything in that language. Different people, different needs. It might cater someone else's needs.

qwertyuiop924 10y ago
You do raise a good point, but I suspect that other users would ask the same question, s/emacs/$EDITOR/gi, and a few other substitutions for the specific commands and plugins (I'm not familiar enough with other ecosystems to say which ones). And Emacs isn't the only way to do CL, it's just got really good support for all lisps: Paredit and SLIME are still some of the extensions against which all others are judged, with most lisps having a SLIME equivalent mode, give or take. But what's so bad about Emacs?
- JaumeGreen 10y ago
  > But what's so bad about Emacs? The time you have to devote to learn it. I get that when you are used to it and use it you get that time back, but I haven't had a job where I could use that, and when I had time I was more of a vi person. On can go up so many learning cliffs until he gets tired of that and just yearns for interfaces that are similar to the ones already known or so easy that no learning is necessary to start using them.
  - qwertyuiop924 10y ago
    VIM has at least decent Lisp support, with a version of Paredit, and SLIMV. I don't know if there's any CIDER equivalent for Clojure development, though.