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Actually what happens in China is that homegrown tech companies will take over the market space left by Western ones, which the government is perfectly happy to

Actually what happens in China is that homegrown tech companies will take over the market space left by Western ones, which the government is perfectly happy to let happen because 1. It keeps the tech industry domestic 2. The servers are physically inside China, guaranteeing them access to the data This is why I've always thought that the Great Firewall's purpose is not only censorship, but also a form of Internet-age protectionism.

mtgx 10y ago
Yes, but they wouldn't be able to do that abruptly. That's why they are now forcing all American companies to create "joint ventures" with the local Chinese companies, which can steal the American technology, and then say 10 years later, the American part can be removed. And American companies seem to go along with it, thinking they have no choice. They do, but they're too scared to lose the Chinese market to risk anything at all, and second, they're too shortsighted to create strong alliances with their competitors to speak out against Chinese policies. Think about how Microsoft was ecstatic that Google was getting banned from China, believing this would be an "opportunity" for the company to gain market share - it wasn't. Baidu filled out all the vacuum left by Google. And now Microsoft has to accept whatever bullshit policies China throws at it, too. Instead of allying with Google and others, it thought it can pull one over Google. That's the kind of shortsighted thinking I'm talking about. If American companies want to thrive in China, they need to create strong alliances and cooperate more against bad Chinese government policies, and not sell each other out for some promised short-term gains, that they'll lose in the end to local companies anyway.
- pmontra 10y ago
  The IT industry is not special. It's not different from other industries that have been nationalized or have to do what the government of the countries they work into wants. The only way out is to somewhat control those governments (good luck with China) or operate within mutual trade agreements signed at government level. Again, China put itself into an almost unassailable negotiation position having so many of the industries of the world. What I see is a trend to rebuild on the Internet the same borders that are enforced in the physical world. Some countries will keep their internets open to each others, others are already closing them down partially. They're probably putting them at a disadvantage, especially the small ones, but the governments usually only cares about keeping their seats.
richarme 10y ago
It's definitely those, and likely also a matter of national security: 3. The CIA doesn't get to know about the private lives of every state and military official and their families.

mtgx 10y ago

Yes, but they wouldn't be able to do that abruptly. That's why they are now forcing all American companies to create "joint ventures" with the local Chinese companies, which can steal the American technology, and then say 10 years later, the American part can be removed. And American companies seem to go along with it, thinking they have no choice. They do, but they're too scared to lose the Chinese market to risk anything at all, and second, they're too shortsighted to create strong alliances with their competitors to speak out against Chinese policies. Think about how Microsoft was ecstatic that Google was getting banned from China, believing this would be an "opportunity" for the company to gain market share - it wasn't. Baidu filled out all the vacuum left by Google. And now Microsoft has to accept whatever bullshit policies China throws at it, too. Instead of allying with Google and others, it thought it can pull one over Google. That's the kind of shortsighted thinking I'm talking about. If American companies want to thrive in China, they need to create strong alliances and cooperate more against bad Chinese government policies, and not sell each other out for some promised short-term gains, that they'll lose in the end to local companies anyway.

pmontra 10y ago
The IT industry is not special. It's not different from other industries that have been nationalized or have to do what the government of the countries they work into wants. The only way out is to somewhat control those governments (good luck with China) or operate within mutual trade agreements signed at government level. Again, China put itself into an almost unassailable negotiation position having so many of the industries of the world. What I see is a trend to rebuild on the Internet the same borders that are enforced in the physical world. Some countries will keep their internets open to each others, others are already closing them down partially. They're probably putting them at a disadvantage, especially the small ones, but the governments usually only cares about keeping their seats.

richarme 10y ago

It's definitely those, and likely also a matter of national security: 3. The CIA doesn't get to know about the private lives of every state and military official and their families.