> Nobody would work those hours unless they actually had to Patio11 will tell you the hours Japanese salarymen have to work to get anywhere. Same sort of situa

> Nobody would work those hours unless they actually had to Patio11 will tell you the hours Japanese salarymen have to work to get anywhere. Same sort of situation; but it's not kids so it's fine ;) If they don't work there what do they do - how do they go to (or afford) school? For the most part this is not a "job for life". There is a career path of sorts and, eventually, you work your way up. This is partly what I mean by stigma: why is school the "better" option. (I can't argue with the hanging out with friends thing :)) I'm sure many would like to have an education; that's the problem to fix - how to offer it to them! I'm not necessarily condoning this as a good situation but it fucks me off when people like the GP make very broad, judging statements with no context or experience of the culture and situation. EDIT: I will say that while I have met several people that work in these places they were all older work-study types. So they were at schools, just working like stink in holidays/downtime. Hell; I did that working on my Aunts farm (voluntarily) doing 14 hour days :) (yes, I realise I had a choice there; not trying to compare too deeply) I have no idea if there are these very young people working there (though I was told there were) or to what extent / why they are forced to be there.