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This argument seems to ignore that the cost of production exhibits economies of scale. The consumer mass market has different margins from a niche industry, eve

This argument seems to ignore that the cost of production exhibits economies of scale. The consumer mass market has different margins from a niche industry, even if both produce cameras. A small company can't leverage nearly the same marginal utility that Apple or Samsung can.

th0br0 10y ago
I doubt that these body cameras are very different from dash board cams (except for a need for more battery power) technically. Dashboard cameras are ephemeral in some parts of the world and cheap _and_ a consumer mass market. Even assuming that it's technically very different: there's ~1 million sworn police officers in the US according to Wikipedia. That quantifies as a mass market for me given the price segment.
- philipov 10y ago
  "By way of comparison, at the weekend launch of iPhone 6s last Sept 25, Apple announced sales of over 13 million units across 3 days. In total, Apple sold 75 million iPhones in the launch quarter, the most it has ever sold." If they sold a single batch of 1 million units to every police officer in the country, it would still not even be in the same league. 1 million total potential customers sold in small batches is not mass market. [0]: http://appleinsider.com/articles/16/07/16/editorial-sorry-android-bloggers-but-samsungs-galaxy-s7-didnt-outsell-apples-iphone-6s http://appleinsider.com/articles/16/07/16/editorial-sorry-an....
turc1656 10y ago
Yes, mass consumer devices have economies of scale that exceed VieVU's capabilities. No doubt about that. But that might account for 20% of the cost and at face value given what the article stated, the product seemingly costs many multiples of any reasonable fee. Also, there should be some sort of economies of scale involved when VieVU is providing tens of thousands of cameras across the country. It's not just the NYPD. I did some additional research and posted a follow up comment that sheds some light on the breakdown of the cost. It makes it more tolerable but still too expensive in my opinion.
- akiselev 10y ago
  20% isnt even close. Where did you get this number? In my time working in hardware (across consumer devices like smartphones and specialized devices for industry) I have never seen a product with only a 20% difference between low volume and mass manufacturing costs. The difference is in the range of 200-1000% when talking about going from 10,000 to a million units, depending on manufacturing setup cost. The lower range is only achievable if your manufacturing line is uninterrupted which I doubt is possible for such small orders and it's impractical for a small government contractor to make many units all at once due to inventory costs and risk. $200 at 10,000 units for a device that sells for $50 or $25 at a million units is par for the course for any hardware product.

th0br0 10y ago

I doubt that these body cameras are very different from dash board cams (except for a need for more battery power) technically. Dashboard cameras are ephemeral in some parts of the world and cheap _and_ a consumer mass market. Even assuming that it's technically very different: there's ~1 million sworn police officers in the US according to Wikipedia. That quantifies as a mass market for me given the price segment.

philipov 10y ago
"By way of comparison, at the weekend launch of iPhone 6s last Sept 25, Apple announced sales of over 13 million units across 3 days. In total, Apple sold 75 million iPhones in the launch quarter, the most it has ever sold." If they sold a single batch of 1 million units to every police officer in the country, it would still not even be in the same league. 1 million total potential customers sold in small batches is not mass market. [0]: http://appleinsider.com/articles/16/07/16/editorial-sorry-android-bloggers-but-samsungs-galaxy-s7-didnt-outsell-apples-iphone-6s http://appleinsider.com/articles/16/07/16/editorial-sorry-an....

turc1656 10y ago

Yes, mass consumer devices have economies of scale that exceed VieVU's capabilities. No doubt about that. But that might account for 20% of the cost and at face value given what the article stated, the product seemingly costs many multiples of any reasonable fee. Also, there should be some sort of economies of scale involved when VieVU is providing tens of thousands of cameras across the country. It's not just the NYPD. I did some additional research and posted a follow up comment that sheds some light on the breakdown of the cost. It makes it more tolerable but still too expensive in my opinion.

akiselev 10y ago
20% isnt even close. Where did you get this number? In my time working in hardware (across consumer devices like smartphones and specialized devices for industry) I have never seen a product with only a 20% difference between low volume and mass manufacturing costs. The difference is in the range of 200-1000% when talking about going from 10,000 to a million units, depending on manufacturing setup cost. The lower range is only achievable if your manufacturing line is uninterrupted which I doubt is possible for such small orders and it's impractical for a small government contractor to make many units all at once due to inventory costs and risk. $200 at 10,000 units for a device that sells for $50 or $25 at a million units is par for the course for any hardware product.