7 ms·

This made me realize how much money my parents had to save in order to buy us a computer for our home. They must have had to save up for months and months for

This made me realize how much money my parents had to save in order to buy us a computer for our home. They must have had to save up for months and months for it. My father was a loan officer at a small community bank and my mom was a homemaker (is that still PC?). Now I work in IT. Thanks for the investment, mom and dad. How humbling.

saiya-jin 10y ago
Exactly same situation. trying to give back a bit by financing reconstruction of house i bought from rest of family for them after grandparents died. Humble place, but much better compared to relatively crappy flat I grew up in crammed with 31 other flats in 1 concrete building. So for their retirement they have more privacy, calm and a tiny land around.
- _spoonman 10y ago
  Ah, cool. Well good luck with the project I hope it turns out better than you imagined.
OJFord 10y ago
> my mom was a homemaker (is that still PC?) I don't know if it's considered PC (can't honestly see why not, if anything other than neutral it's actually offering more respect) but it's certainly US-centric. I've never heard it outside of US TV/films.
jackhack 10y ago
Similar experiences here, spoonman. A computer in the 70s/80s was a serious expense, similar to buying a nice used car, or a year of state college. My folks bought me an Apple ][ around 1980. $2500 bought : 1mhz, 48k of ram, 1 floppy drive, a 9" Sanyo monochrome monitor, and what seemed like an endless universe of possibilities. The next six years were a blur of Assembly (Lazer Systems Interactive Compiler), and Applesoft Basic, trying to unlock the secrets of that machine and write my own games. It was magic! I am 100% certain that $2500 investment by my folks is the reason I have had a career in software. I remember riding a 10-speed bike downtown to Computerland to buy an individual floppy disc @ $5/each. The university bookstore only sold Gorilla brand, and they were around $7 each. Imagine the joy when I learned to use a scissors (later, a nibbler tool) to cut a notch out of floppy case so I could use both sides. Like finding free money! Now a RaspPi Zero is $5 and information is limitless. This is a gilded age.
- lisper 10y ago
  > This is a gilded age. That is quite possibly the biggest understatement in the history of humanity. And it's not just because computer hardware has become essentially free. When I was a kid, to get any kind of information meant waiting for the daily newspaper to be delivered, or a trip to the library, or, if you were lucky, pulling out a volume from the encyclopedia on the book shelf (another very pricey commodity in those days). It still boggles my mind that you can buy a full-featured Gnu/Linux server for the price of a hamburger, and Wikipedia is literally free. It's a freakin' miracle.
  - jandrese 10y ago
    And your local library often didn't even have any books in whatever interest area you were looking for. Or maybe it had one from 1967 that was hopelessly out of date with the current state of the art. My parents bought a Commodore 64 when I was a kid and I loved the thing, but I've come to realize over the years that I knew almost nothing about it as a kid. I had never even heard of PEEK/POKE and if it wasn't in the (admittedly pretty good) manual then there was basically no chance that I would. I remember the manual briefly touched on the sprite generator, but not in enough detail that a kid who only knows BASIC could use it. It never even mentioned the SID sound chip. The only "computer" books my library had were talking about CDC machines and IBM mainframes, or extremely general discussions about core memory and them fancy new transistor things. I think they might have had some programming language books too, but since I didn't have any compilers they were useless. This was in the 80s. Today's kids can get in depth information on almost anything, and have ways of talking with experts if they get stuck. I'm excited to see how they turn out.
    - ptrincr 10y ago
      Actually, the manual, at least the one I got with my C64, did mention many of those aspects and even gave examples of them. This is the one: http://www.retrogamingworld.co.uk/images/thumbnails/350/525/detailed/3/commodore64usermanual-2518.jpg http://www.retrogamingworld.co.uk/images/thumbnails/350/525/... As a kid I didn't really understand much of it, I remember making a simple sprite move around the screen, and designing my own sprite using the grid example it gave. However looking back at the manual now, it's amazing how much detail it goes into, from sprite positioning, sprite expansion, drawing multiple sprites ( all via POKE and PEEK) to programming the SID chip (one whole chapter on this). It doesn't deal with handling sprite collision though, so you would struggle to make a game I suppose. But the manual is surprisingly in depth. It does mention that for more advanced topics you would need the "C64 programmers reference guide".
refurb 10y ago
The median household income in the US in 1980 was $17,000 (compared to $53,000 today). Spending $3000 on a computer in 1980 is the equivalent of spending $9,000 today. Like you said, you could get a really nice used car for that.
- maxerickson 10y ago
  That's about the same number as you get using CPI: http://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl?cost1=3000&year1=1980&year2=2016 http://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl?cost1=3000&year1=1980...
- matthewmcg 10y ago
  "I asked for a car, I got a computer." Ferris Bueller's Day Off (1986) Sums up the situation nicely.
- ArkyBeagle 10y ago
  I recall a new Datsun B-210 from the 1970s being around $3k. It's hardly an Eldo, but I thought they were pretty nice cars.
kls 10y ago
My grandparents always encouraged my interest in computers and I owned a lot of the toy computers (C64, tandy et. al.) but the first "real" computer as in over a grand was an Amiga they bought me, I think they put 4K into that thing with all the bells and whistles. That is a lot of coin for a citrus farmer, especially back then. My grandpa who was an engineer in the Air Force before retiring and going back to the family farm, was convinced that computers where going to change the world. He would always say one day these things are going to talk to each other all over the world and it's going to change everything. Anyways long story short, they always boasted about it being the best money they ever spent.
cwbrandsma 10y ago
My wife calls herself a homemaker (she is a stay-at-home mom), I'm sure the term offends someone out there...oh well. That is just the inevitability of communicating these days.
- happyslobro 10y ago
  Apparently, even discussing the issue is no longer permitted. We've flown way past offense, deep into taboo territory.
tibbon 10y ago
And yet, people complain about how expensive an Apple computer is- when they are cheaper than ever. A fully loaded Macbook Pro with every option is still less than the entry "business model" of any of these computers in 1980
- jacquesm 10y ago
  The first computers were built like tanks and typically were in use for a decade or more before being deprecated. That fully loaded Macbook Pro will be outdated before the ink of the advert is properly dried. It's a huge difference if you can deprecate an investment over a large number of years or if you're expected to buy something new every one or two years. Tablets and phones are even worse when it comes to aging.
  - dangoor 10y ago
    I disagree. My father bought one of those TRS-80 Model IIIs in 1980, and I used it tons. By 1985, though, we had migrated over to a PC. Our Model III had been really decked out (even had a 5MB hard drive that we had gotten in a closeout deal). The difference between what you could do with a 1985 PC and a 1980 Model III was huge. In contrast, we have a 2009 MacBook Pro. Still works just fine for web browsing, word processing and things of that nature. Mobile phone hardware is moving super fast as desktop computers were in the '80s, but I think that the improvements in desktop (well, laptop is the equivalent today) hardware are less important for most people.
    - jacquesm 10y ago
      When you migrate from one architecture to another it is kind of logical that you would get a new machine. The TRS-80 wasn't able to compete with the PC for very long (though in the beginning there was of course more software available for the TRS-80). But if you had stuck with the CP/M world you would have been able to run that old hardware for many years more. Note how you have relegated your 2009 MacBook Pro to 'web browsing, words processing and things of that nature', whereas as a developers machine it is likely quite underpowered. We are also at the end of the easy pickings from Moore's law so this too means that machine replacement pace is now (fortunately) finally dropping off a bit. But phones and tablets are basically an exercise in planned obsolescence and computers while they last a bit longer than in the past are still being replaced quite frequently. Your MacBook Pro is on it's 'second life', no longer in use for its primary purpose.
spaceisballer 10y ago
I remember when my dad bought us a Mac IIci, it was awesome. But I'm pretty sure it was about $2000 back then.
Scottn1 10y ago
Same here. Pre-teen kid fascinated by this new tech. Looking back I have no idea how my mom/dad afforded it. In fact, my mom went behind my dad's back to buy it for me as he said they could not afford it. I remember the exact location of the store we went to at the time still. I actually got a genuine IBM (only the best mom.. THANKS!). Something like $3000+ at the time. Later added a $300 modem after seeing War Games. I attribute a large part to my mom, basically no questions asked, in getting me that first PC to my whole career in IT. As well as a tinkerer of tech stuff and still prefer fixing electronic stuff and building my own PC from parts than buying name brand ones. I'm 43. I need to tell her thanks again next time I see her for basically taking a $9k loan out (in today's $$) for her 10yo son for this gadget computer stuff that was starting to take off that no one else in our circle of friends really even knew much about.
FrancoDiaz 10y ago
In the late 70's my friend's dad bought a Poly-88 (http://www.polymorphic-computers.com/poly88.html http://www.polymorphic-computers.com/poly88.html) for engineering work. I think that cost about $2k. I believe the Apple IIe that my parents bought me in the early-mid 80s was around 2k. The Commodore 64 that I had before the Apple IIe was much priced much more reasonably, but that thing conked out on me within a week.
DannyB2 10y ago
Also consider that those dollars in 1981 are worth maybe 3 and a half of our dollars today. So for a $249 pocket computer, which I have fond memories of. Assume that 16 K memory device would cost about, let's say, $800 today. That makes a much stronger impression of how much cheaper hardware has become, as well as more capable.

saiya-jin 10y ago

Exactly same situation. trying to give back a bit by financing reconstruction of house i bought from rest of family for them after grandparents died. Humble place, but much better compared to relatively crappy flat I grew up in crammed with 31 other flats in 1 concrete building. So for their retirement they have more privacy, calm and a tiny land around.

_spoonman 10y ago
Ah, cool. Well good luck with the project I hope it turns out better than you imagined.

OJFord 10y ago

> my mom was a homemaker (is that still PC?) I don't know if it's considered PC (can't honestly see why not, if anything other than neutral it's actually offering more respect) but it's certainly US-centric. I've never heard it outside of US TV/films.

jackhack 10y ago

Similar experiences here, spoonman. A computer in the 70s/80s was a serious expense, similar to buying a nice used car, or a year of state college. My folks bought me an Apple ][ around 1980. $2500 bought : 1mhz, 48k of ram, 1 floppy drive, a 9" Sanyo monochrome monitor, and what seemed like an endless universe of possibilities. The next six years were a blur of Assembly (Lazer Systems Interactive Compiler), and Applesoft Basic, trying to unlock the secrets of that machine and write my own games. It was magic! I am 100% certain that $2500 investment by my folks is the reason I have had a career in software. I remember riding a 10-speed bike downtown to Computerland to buy an individual floppy disc @ $5/each. The university bookstore only sold Gorilla brand, and they were around $7 each. Imagine the joy when I learned to use a scissors (later, a nibbler tool) to cut a notch out of floppy case so I could use both sides. Like finding free money! Now a RaspPi Zero is $5 and information is limitless. This is a gilded age.

lisper 10y ago
> This is a gilded age. That is quite possibly the biggest understatement in the history of humanity. And it's not just because computer hardware has become essentially free. When I was a kid, to get any kind of information meant waiting for the daily newspaper to be delivered, or a trip to the library, or, if you were lucky, pulling out a volume from the encyclopedia on the book shelf (another very pricey commodity in those days). It still boggles my mind that you can buy a full-featured Gnu/Linux server for the price of a hamburger, and Wikipedia is literally free. It's a freakin' miracle.
- jandrese 10y ago
  And your local library often didn't even have any books in whatever interest area you were looking for. Or maybe it had one from 1967 that was hopelessly out of date with the current state of the art. My parents bought a Commodore 64 when I was a kid and I loved the thing, but I've come to realize over the years that I knew almost nothing about it as a kid. I had never even heard of PEEK/POKE and if it wasn't in the (admittedly pretty good) manual then there was basically no chance that I would. I remember the manual briefly touched on the sprite generator, but not in enough detail that a kid who only knows BASIC could use it. It never even mentioned the SID sound chip. The only "computer" books my library had were talking about CDC machines and IBM mainframes, or extremely general discussions about core memory and them fancy new transistor things. I think they might have had some programming language books too, but since I didn't have any compilers they were useless. This was in the 80s. Today's kids can get in depth information on almost anything, and have ways of talking with experts if they get stuck. I'm excited to see how they turn out.
  - ptrincr 10y ago
    Actually, the manual, at least the one I got with my C64, did mention many of those aspects and even gave examples of them. This is the one: http://www.retrogamingworld.co.uk/images/thumbnails/350/525/detailed/3/commodore64usermanual-2518.jpg http://www.retrogamingworld.co.uk/images/thumbnails/350/525/... As a kid I didn't really understand much of it, I remember making a simple sprite move around the screen, and designing my own sprite using the grid example it gave. However looking back at the manual now, it's amazing how much detail it goes into, from sprite positioning, sprite expansion, drawing multiple sprites ( all via POKE and PEEK) to programming the SID chip (one whole chapter on this). It doesn't deal with handling sprite collision though, so you would struggle to make a game I suppose. But the manual is surprisingly in depth. It does mention that for more advanced topics you would need the "C64 programmers reference guide".

refurb 10y ago

The median household income in the US in 1980 was $17,000 (compared to $53,000 today). Spending $3000 on a computer in 1980 is the equivalent of spending $9,000 today. Like you said, you could get a really nice used car for that.

maxerickson 10y ago
That's about the same number as you get using CPI: http://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl?cost1=3000&year1=1980&year2=2016 http://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl?cost1=3000&year1=1980...
matthewmcg 10y ago
"I asked for a car, I got a computer." Ferris Bueller's Day Off (1986) Sums up the situation nicely.
ArkyBeagle 10y ago
I recall a new Datsun B-210 from the 1970s being around $3k. It's hardly an Eldo, but I thought they were pretty nice cars.

kls 10y ago

My grandparents always encouraged my interest in computers and I owned a lot of the toy computers (C64, tandy et. al.) but the first "real" computer as in over a grand was an Amiga they bought me, I think they put 4K into that thing with all the bells and whistles. That is a lot of coin for a citrus farmer, especially back then. My grandpa who was an engineer in the Air Force before retiring and going back to the family farm, was convinced that computers where going to change the world. He would always say one day these things are going to talk to each other all over the world and it's going to change everything. Anyways long story short, they always boasted about it being the best money they ever spent.

cwbrandsma 10y ago

My wife calls herself a homemaker (she is a stay-at-home mom), I'm sure the term offends someone out there...oh well. That is just the inevitability of communicating these days.

happyslobro 10y ago
Apparently, even discussing the issue is no longer permitted. We've flown way past offense, deep into taboo territory.

tibbon 10y ago

And yet, people complain about how expensive an Apple computer is- when they are cheaper than ever. A fully loaded Macbook Pro with every option is still less than the entry "business model" of any of these computers in 1980

jacquesm 10y ago
The first computers were built like tanks and typically were in use for a decade or more before being deprecated. That fully loaded Macbook Pro will be outdated before the ink of the advert is properly dried. It's a huge difference if you can deprecate an investment over a large number of years or if you're expected to buy something new every one or two years. Tablets and phones are even worse when it comes to aging.
- dangoor 10y ago
  I disagree. My father bought one of those TRS-80 Model IIIs in 1980, and I used it tons. By 1985, though, we had migrated over to a PC. Our Model III had been really decked out (even had a 5MB hard drive that we had gotten in a closeout deal). The difference between what you could do with a 1985 PC and a 1980 Model III was huge. In contrast, we have a 2009 MacBook Pro. Still works just fine for web browsing, word processing and things of that nature. Mobile phone hardware is moving super fast as desktop computers were in the '80s, but I think that the improvements in desktop (well, laptop is the equivalent today) hardware are less important for most people.
  - jacquesm 10y ago
    When you migrate from one architecture to another it is kind of logical that you would get a new machine. The TRS-80 wasn't able to compete with the PC for very long (though in the beginning there was of course more software available for the TRS-80). But if you had stuck with the CP/M world you would have been able to run that old hardware for many years more. Note how you have relegated your 2009 MacBook Pro to 'web browsing, words processing and things of that nature', whereas as a developers machine it is likely quite underpowered. We are also at the end of the easy pickings from Moore's law so this too means that machine replacement pace is now (fortunately) finally dropping off a bit. But phones and tablets are basically an exercise in planned obsolescence and computers while they last a bit longer than in the past are still being replaced quite frequently. Your MacBook Pro is on it's 'second life', no longer in use for its primary purpose.

spaceisballer 10y ago

I remember when my dad bought us a Mac IIci, it was awesome. But I'm pretty sure it was about $2000 back then.

Scottn1 10y ago

Same here. Pre-teen kid fascinated by this new tech. Looking back I have no idea how my mom/dad afforded it. In fact, my mom went behind my dad's back to buy it for me as he said they could not afford it. I remember the exact location of the store we went to at the time still. I actually got a genuine IBM (only the best mom.. THANKS!). Something like $3000+ at the time. Later added a $300 modem after seeing War Games. I attribute a large part to my mom, basically no questions asked, in getting me that first PC to my whole career in IT. As well as a tinkerer of tech stuff and still prefer fixing electronic stuff and building my own PC from parts than buying name brand ones. I'm 43. I need to tell her thanks again next time I see her for basically taking a $9k loan out (in today's $$) for her 10yo son for this gadget computer stuff that was starting to take off that no one else in our circle of friends really even knew much about.

FrancoDiaz 10y ago

In the late 70's my friend's dad bought a Poly-88 (http://www.polymorphic-computers.com/poly88.html http://www.polymorphic-computers.com/poly88.html) for engineering work. I think that cost about $2k. I believe the Apple IIe that my parents bought me in the early-mid 80s was around 2k. The Commodore 64 that I had before the Apple IIe was much priced much more reasonably, but that thing conked out on me within a week.

DannyB2 10y ago

Also consider that those dollars in 1981 are worth maybe 3 and a half of our dollars today. So for a $249 pocket computer, which I have fond memories of. Assume that 16 K memory device would cost about, let's say, $800 today. That makes a much stronger impression of how much cheaper hardware has become, as well as more capable.