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I have been checking that site a few times per week last month to see if they finally got around reviewing the iPhone 7 Plus, but no cigar. It has been out for

by dep_b 10y ago

I have been checking that site a few times per week last month to see if they finally got around reviewing the iPhone 7 Plus, but no cigar. It has been out for over a month now and if you like it or not it's still one of the most popular mobile phone cameras in the world and definitely an upgrade compared to the regular iPhone 7 camera. And then you see a slide where Google uses the word iPhone 5 times to tell the world why their iPhone is well worth the iPhone price, lacking a score for the iPhone 7 Plus, and the reason for the delay suddenly becomes clear. Well paid, Google. Well paid. And Dxomark: you only have one reputation...

mistermann 10y ago
Wow, they better have paid big for that.
kyrra 10y ago
Or they are waiting for iOS 10.1 that includes full portrait mode. https://9to5mac.com/2016/09/21/hands-on-portrait-mode-beta-iphone-7-plus/ https://9to5mac.com/2016/09/21/hands-on-portrait-mode-beta-i... That was a big selling point during the announcement of the iPhone 7+, so seems worth waiting for that feature to be ready before completing the review.
- ubercow13 10y ago
  That example shot looks...really bad..
dogma1138 10y ago
DoXMark is probably the only website that has a proper methodology for reviewing mobile phone cameras. They are consistent, very indepth, have objective scoring metrics and haven't shown any bias towards any brand or maker. The iPhone 7 plus isn't an easy phone to evaluate because it has dual cameras, reviews of other phones with dual cameras also tended to lag and those were simpler where the 2 cameras were identical and were used to speed up or add additional digital zoom whilst the iPhone 7P uses 2 different cameras. The iPhone 7 review was up 20 days after it was announced, and effectively about 9-10 days after it has became available in Europe. It's pretty laughable that pretty much the only objective source out there and the only one that has bothered to take a scientific approach to evaluating the quality of cameras for mobile phones is accused of bias and being a paid lip service just because their current methodology is not compatible with the iPhone 7 Plus not to mention considering that iOS 10 also lacks support for certain modes for the 7P, and they want to actually give it a proper review, which means put it in cases where both cameras can be measured objectively.
- dep_b 10y ago
  I am not saying any of your arguments doesn't hold up and the iOS 10.1 upgrade of course also crossed my mind. But you have to understand that Google got early access to it's review results, permissions to use them in their keynote and to also use competitors results. This is not free, even if only they received services or free hardware for it in return. Once you start doing that there's no return. Because they could have reviewed the iPhone 7 Plus using the iOS 10.1 betas. And what about the final number? Isn't the difference between 88, 89 or 90 also up to the personal opinion of the reviewer? How are bokeh foto's and true zoom weighed? If it is 88 instead of 89, how much did the Google bribe influence it? It's still a possible deviation within their rigid testing methodology depending on the reviewer's opinion. I see a lot of websites that are clearly sponsored in one way or another. Samsung does it, Lenovo does it. I think Samsung and Lenovo products aren't bad but I know they spend a lot of money on massaging online review sources. Dxomark didn't give me that "might be sponsored in a way" feeling, now I just don't know.
  - dogma1138 10y ago
    The company's business model is doing testing and publishing (and selling results) the results (as well as selling actual cameras for the iPhone and image processing software). Their methodology and scoring algorithms are open. https://www.dxomark.com/About/In-depth-measurements/DxOMark-testing-protocols https://www.dxomark.com/About/In-depth-measurements/DxOMark-... They have evaluated 1000's of cameras, lenses and sensors, and all of a sudden they are biased because Apple doesn't ship pre-production units to get reviewed? This is beyond pathetic, I love my iPhone but I never considered it to be the king of anything, even as far as the camera quality goes, it was overall one of the best rounded camera's but for quite a long time it wasn't the king. The iPhone 3/3GS had pretty shitty camera's, like god damn awful, things have started to pick up with the 4 and 5 and the 5 was probably the only period where the iPhone might have been more or less uncontested, but since the 6 there were phones that were getting very close and even beating the iOS devices at certain aspects of the camera, and with this generation things are pretty much dead even as far high end devices go. P.S. It's quite likely that their full reports are available to purchase indirectly, this is how many of these niche firms work, this doesn't mean that there is bias, it's just the nature of these things these reviews are extremely expensive.
dilap 10y ago
Seems like a plausible conspiracy theory to me, but it's also a pretty honest way to be shady -- no compromise of the reviews themswlves.
JustSomeNobody 10y ago
Or... or... they are waiting for the portrait mode to come out of beta. Just a thought.

by dep_b 10y ago

mistermann 10y ago

Wow, they better have paid big for that.

kyrra 10y ago

Or they are waiting for iOS 10.1 that includes full portrait mode. https://9to5mac.com/2016/09/21/hands-on-portrait-mode-beta-iphone-7-plus/ https://9to5mac.com/2016/09/21/hands-on-portrait-mode-beta-i... That was a big selling point during the announcement of the iPhone 7+, so seems worth waiting for that feature to be ready before completing the review.

ubercow13 10y ago
That example shot looks...really bad..

dogma1138 10y ago

DoXMark is probably the only website that has a proper methodology for reviewing mobile phone cameras. They are consistent, very indepth, have objective scoring metrics and haven't shown any bias towards any brand or maker. The iPhone 7 plus isn't an easy phone to evaluate because it has dual cameras, reviews of other phones with dual cameras also tended to lag and those were simpler where the 2 cameras were identical and were used to speed up or add additional digital zoom whilst the iPhone 7P uses 2 different cameras. The iPhone 7 review was up 20 days after it was announced, and effectively about 9-10 days after it has became available in Europe. It's pretty laughable that pretty much the only objective source out there and the only one that has bothered to take a scientific approach to evaluating the quality of cameras for mobile phones is accused of bias and being a paid lip service just because their current methodology is not compatible with the iPhone 7 Plus not to mention considering that iOS 10 also lacks support for certain modes for the 7P, and they want to actually give it a proper review, which means put it in cases where both cameras can be measured objectively.

dep_b 10y ago
I am not saying any of your arguments doesn't hold up and the iOS 10.1 upgrade of course also crossed my mind. But you have to understand that Google got early access to it's review results, permissions to use them in their keynote and to also use competitors results. This is not free, even if only they received services or free hardware for it in return. Once you start doing that there's no return. Because they could have reviewed the iPhone 7 Plus using the iOS 10.1 betas. And what about the final number? Isn't the difference between 88, 89 or 90 also up to the personal opinion of the reviewer? How are bokeh foto's and true zoom weighed? If it is 88 instead of 89, how much did the Google bribe influence it? It's still a possible deviation within their rigid testing methodology depending on the reviewer's opinion. I see a lot of websites that are clearly sponsored in one way or another. Samsung does it, Lenovo does it. I think Samsung and Lenovo products aren't bad but I know they spend a lot of money on massaging online review sources. Dxomark didn't give me that "might be sponsored in a way" feeling, now I just don't know.
- dogma1138 10y ago
  The company's business model is doing testing and publishing (and selling results) the results (as well as selling actual cameras for the iPhone and image processing software). Their methodology and scoring algorithms are open. https://www.dxomark.com/About/In-depth-measurements/DxOMark-testing-protocols https://www.dxomark.com/About/In-depth-measurements/DxOMark-... They have evaluated 1000's of cameras, lenses and sensors, and all of a sudden they are biased because Apple doesn't ship pre-production units to get reviewed? This is beyond pathetic, I love my iPhone but I never considered it to be the king of anything, even as far as the camera quality goes, it was overall one of the best rounded camera's but for quite a long time it wasn't the king. The iPhone 3/3GS had pretty shitty camera's, like god damn awful, things have started to pick up with the 4 and 5 and the 5 was probably the only period where the iPhone might have been more or less uncontested, but since the 6 there were phones that were getting very close and even beating the iOS devices at certain aspects of the camera, and with this generation things are pretty much dead even as far high end devices go. P.S. It's quite likely that their full reports are available to purchase indirectly, this is how many of these niche firms work, this doesn't mean that there is bias, it's just the nature of these things these reviews are extremely expensive.

dilap 10y ago

Seems like a plausible conspiracy theory to me, but it's also a pretty honest way to be shady -- no compromise of the reviews themswlves.

JustSomeNobody 10y ago

Or... or... they are waiting for the portrait mode to come out of beta. Just a thought.