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but instead Apple decided to let Adobe invest time and money into the development of the product only to rush in at the last minute and say, "sorry, you can

but instead Apple decided to let Adobe invest time and money into the development of the product only to rush in at the last minute and say, "sorry, you can't do that." Uhm, did Adobe even ask Apple about its plans before starting to working on the product? Did they discussed "business plans" with Apple? Does Apple owe something to Adobe? So now if I own a platform and have plans for it, should I go around asking all the guys "hey do you plan to do something on my platform"? If they are going to do something, they should approach me and discuss it.

pyre 17y ago
I didn't say that Apple is required to notify Adobe. I said that it was a 'dick move.' I find it highly unlikely that Apple would just happen to change the TOS right in a way that invalidates an Adobe product a few days before that Adobe product is set to launch. I'm not claiming that Apple needs to ask everyone on their platform for permission to change the TOS, but it seems to me that Apple planned this in some way to 'stick it to Adobe.' > Uhm, did Adobe even ask Apple about its plans before starting to working on the product? Did they discussed "business plans" with Apple? No, there is no requirement that people discuss their business plans with Apple before targeting their platform. Is everyone that creates products targeting the iPhone/iPad platform supposed to ask Apple permission before even starting? I'm curious for you to try and defend this position, especially with the AppStore approval process already in place. Also take into account that this move seems to block Unity3D. Keep in mind that Unity3D won an Apple Design Award given to them by Apple themselves. I would take that as a tip of the hat by Apple to the creation of 3rd-party developer tools for the creation of iPhone/iPad apps. > So now if I own a platform and have plans for it, should I go around asking all the guys "hey do you plan to do something on my platform"? If they are going to do something, they should approach me and discuss it. So, when I want to develop a piece of software for MS Windows, I should be required to ask Microsoft permission? The point in my original post was that I'm fairly sure that Apple knew about Adobe's product and purposefully timed their change to the TOS to the maximum amount of damage. If Apple knows that Adobe is developing a product that they will do everything in their power to block, why not be civilized about it and tell Adobe outright that they will not let that product into their platform? The only way that you can frame this as "Adobe should have fallen before the throne of Apple and begged for permission," is if you think that creating a tool to aid in the development if iPhone/iPad apps is something that Apple will try to block. I think that it was a reasonable assumption to think that Apple would not try to block such things.
- rimantas 17y ago
  in a way that invalidates an Adobe product a few days before that Adobe product is set to launch. You can look at it this way: Adobe's product would invalidate Apple's product it is about to launch: iPhone OS 4 (and iPhone experience in general). I think Jason Snell put it rather well: http://www.macworld.com/article/150539/2010/04/apple_world.html http://www.macworld.com/article/150539/2010/04/apple_world.h...
  - pyre 17y ago
    > Adobe's product would invalidate Apple's product it is about to launch: iPhone OS 4 Adobe can't 'invalidate' iPhone OS 4 unless you're claiming that Flash CS5's Flash-to-iPhone cross-compiler prevents developers from using Apple's own development environment. > (and iPhone experience in general). You can't 'invalidate' the iPhone experience. If everything about the iPhone is so micro-managed by Apple to be perfectly what they want, then explain to me how 'fart apps' fit into Steve Jobs' grand plan for the iPhone. People don't need Flash CS5 to create crappy apps for the iPhone. In any case, I thought that the AppStore approval process was there to keep out crappy apps. Apple is the gatekeeper for all apps that are allowed in to the walled garden, so why should they care how the app is created so long as it meets their standards? > From your link: Apple doesn’t want Flash-created apps on the App Store for a simple reason: It reduces the iPhone to a lowest-common denominator platform, and at that point Apple loses all control over the iPhone OS experience. This is a false statement. Apple has supreme ultimate control over the iPhoneOS experience. Every application that is allowed to run on the iPhoneOS has to be approved by Apple through their AppStore approval process. It's already been proven that 3rd-party developer tools like MonoTouch can work. 10 of the top 100 apps on the AppStore were built with MonoTouch, and there are hundreds of other apps approved by Apple that are on the AppStore as well. The idea that allowing developers to step outside of Apple's ivory tower of developer tools to use something else is a guarantee of lower quality products is a joke.

pyre 17y ago

I didn't say that Apple is required to notify Adobe. I said that it was a 'dick move.' I find it highly unlikely that Apple would just happen to change the TOS right in a way that invalidates an Adobe product a few days before that Adobe product is set to launch. I'm not claiming that Apple needs to ask everyone on their platform for permission to change the TOS, but it seems to me that Apple planned this in some way to 'stick it to Adobe.' > Uhm, did Adobe even ask Apple about its plans before starting to working on the product? Did they discussed "business plans" with Apple? No, there is no requirement that people discuss their business plans with Apple before targeting their platform. Is everyone that creates products targeting the iPhone/iPad platform supposed to ask Apple permission before even starting? I'm curious for you to try and defend this position, especially with the AppStore approval process already in place. Also take into account that this move seems to block Unity3D. Keep in mind that Unity3D won an Apple Design Award given to them by Apple themselves. I would take that as a tip of the hat by Apple to the creation of 3rd-party developer tools for the creation of iPhone/iPad apps. > So now if I own a platform and have plans for it, should I go around asking all the guys "hey do you plan to do something on my platform"? If they are going to do something, they should approach me and discuss it. So, when I want to develop a piece of software for MS Windows, I should be required to ask Microsoft permission? The point in my original post was that I'm fairly sure that Apple knew about Adobe's product and purposefully timed their change to the TOS to the maximum amount of damage. If Apple knows that Adobe is developing a product that they will do everything in their power to block, why not be civilized about it and tell Adobe outright that they will not let that product into their platform? The only way that you can frame this as "Adobe should have fallen before the throne of Apple and begged for permission," is if you think that creating a tool to aid in the development if iPhone/iPad apps is something that Apple will try to block. I think that it was a reasonable assumption to think that Apple would not try to block such things.

rimantas 17y ago
in a way that invalidates an Adobe product a few days before that Adobe product is set to launch. You can look at it this way: Adobe's product would invalidate Apple's product it is about to launch: iPhone OS 4 (and iPhone experience in general). I think Jason Snell put it rather well: http://www.macworld.com/article/150539/2010/04/apple_world.html http://www.macworld.com/article/150539/2010/04/apple_world.h...
- pyre 17y ago
  > Adobe's product would invalidate Apple's product it is about to launch: iPhone OS 4 Adobe can't 'invalidate' iPhone OS 4 unless you're claiming that Flash CS5's Flash-to-iPhone cross-compiler prevents developers from using Apple's own development environment. > (and iPhone experience in general). You can't 'invalidate' the iPhone experience. If everything about the iPhone is so micro-managed by Apple to be perfectly what they want, then explain to me how 'fart apps' fit into Steve Jobs' grand plan for the iPhone. People don't need Flash CS5 to create crappy apps for the iPhone. In any case, I thought that the AppStore approval process was there to keep out crappy apps. Apple is the gatekeeper for all apps that are allowed in to the walled garden, so why should they care how the app is created so long as it meets their standards? > From your link: Apple doesn’t want Flash-created apps on the App Store for a simple reason: It reduces the iPhone to a lowest-common denominator platform, and at that point Apple loses all control over the iPhone OS experience. This is a false statement. Apple has supreme ultimate control over the iPhoneOS experience. Every application that is allowed to run on the iPhoneOS has to be approved by Apple through their AppStore approval process. It's already been proven that 3rd-party developer tools like MonoTouch can work. 10 of the top 100 apps on the AppStore were built with MonoTouch, and there are hundreds of other apps approved by Apple that are on the AppStore as well. The idea that allowing developers to step outside of Apple's ivory tower of developer tools to use something else is a guarantee of lower quality products is a joke.