5 ms·

I don't have any experience with Azure. Are prices competitive with AWS?

kefka 10y ago
Absolutely not. If anything, they are worse at hidden billing than Comcast. Then again, AWS is also pretty atrocious as well (just rear Glacier horror stories). But more people understand the pricing with AWS. I find that Azure is about 1.5x the price of similar services from AWS. I've not looked at GCE. But those are my experiences. YMMV
- jedberg 10y ago
  > just rear Glacier horror stories In Amazon's defense, their pricing is pretty clear and straightforward except for Glacier, which even they admit doesn't follow their pricing model for all the other services. Google's is still the best though -- they automatically give you "bulk discounts" instead of having to buy them in advance like AWS, and their general philosophy is "your cheapest option should be to finish your workload as quickly as possible", as opposed to AWS, where you have to do some acrobatics to fit into their pricing models efficiently.
- rnnr 10y ago
  Also, isn't AWS billing per utilization/hour? For small projects this means it is many times cheaper than Azure. Azure is more focused to enterprises than to individual devs.
  - blahi 10y ago
    wat? Azure has minute billing... So does google. AWS is a mess.
    - rnnr 10y ago
      Not in Azure SQL
    - kefka 10y ago
      Yes, and if you were doing anything with the recently killed (or soon to be) RemoteApp, billing there was a disaster. Absolute horrible disaster. Overbilled to my employer because their websites did not equal to what they quoted us. They also refuse to honor enterprise contract regarding transfer (Internet2 peer). Just horrible terrible bad no good. And their MQTT service (IoT) pricing is a joke. $50/month for 400k messages a day (!second, typo) with a cap of 4k? Seriously? That's just 4.6 messages a second, WITH a data restriction that MQTT itself doesn't have. I routinely load pictures with motion to "house/frontdoor/motion/" topic in the form of a jpg. MQTT specifies nothing about said data ~ I could even store a dvd VOB for video in a topic. And this offering is for a max data of 48GB/month. To put this in perspective, a dialup modem(!) Gets a top speed of 5.2KB/s , which sustained across a 30 day month = 43.2GB I can (and have!) bought a cheap-shit VPS server and installed Mosquitto on it. I can use MQTT as the spec indicates, including Websockets and storing picture data. And it's more on the price range of $40/year, not $600/yr source: https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/pricing/details/iot-hub/ https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/pricing/details/iot-hub/
      - trevyn 10y ago
        Your dialup modem math is wrong: https://www.google.com/webhp?ie=UTF-8#q=(5.2+kilobytes%2Fsec)+*+30+days https://www.google.com/webhp?ie=UTF-8#q=(5.2+kilobytes%2Fsec... (13.48 GB)
        kefka 10y ago
        I can only blame the... uhh..err.. uhmm... The Windows Calculator! Blast it all! :)
  - UK-AL 10y ago
    Azure is per minute
- craigvn 10y ago
  I find the prices pretty straightforward mostly, the portal will give you an estimate of the monthly cost for all your current services. The problem is the data transfer pricing. Say you have a website that has 5000 visits a day, it is really hard to estimate your IN/OUT GB, then do the same for blob storage or other services.
- praseodym 10y ago
  You'd think Microsoft would be the go-to provider for SQL Server workloads, but Azure SQL is terribly expensive for some (many?) workloads. For read-intensive SQL Server workloads you'll be paying upwards of $465/mo (Premium P1 [1]) for something that can be easily handled by a beefy VM for a fraction of the price. Also, the Azure SQL pricing model links performance ('eDTUs') to storage which skews the billing model even further. [1] https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/pricing/details/sql-database/ https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/pricing/details/sql-databa...
  - kefka 10y ago
    Precisely. I highlight a similar pricing breakdown with their IoT / MQTT service and their price inanities as well. As far as I can tell, this insane pricing is for the idea of "Can't go wrong with purchasing Microsoft Services".... when in actuality, you can go very much wrong.
  - maglite77 10y ago
    [Disclosure: I work for Microsoft] One thing to keep in mind for Azure SQL: you are getting a guaranteed SLA [1], business continuity and full point-in-time backups (up to 30 days) [2] for that price. To compare effectively you would need to price out a comparable Always-On cluster, domain controllers, SAN storage (for replication), and backup solution + storage. [1]: https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/support/legal/sla/sql-database/v1_1/ https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/support/legal/sla/sql-data... [2]: https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/documentation/articles/sql-database-business-continuity/ https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/documentation/articles/sql...
Someone1234 10y ago
Reserved instance pricing on AWS absolutely destroys Azure. If you do on-demand on both, they look competitive, but there are ways of bringing AWS down which Azure simply cannot match.
- vgt 10y ago
  Have you had a chance to look at Google's Preemptible VMs? They're a fixed 70-80% off of list price. Another point is, Google's VMs are generic CPU/RAM combinations. You don't need "network optimized VMs" or "storage optimized VMs" - you simply get those things on any VM. This makes the "excess instance supply" market much more fluid and simplifies folks' lives. Happy to discuss further! (work at GCP)
  - xiaomai 10y ago
    That's nice, I'm using azure for a windows vm and it's been super frustrating trying to get reasonable performance. (RAM/CPU/etc. is all great but the standard IO is so slow it's basically unusable (i'm maxing out at 10M/s (I think due to iops limitiations).
  - dimfeld 10y ago
    Google's sustained use discounts for standard (non-preemptible) VMs are a huge win as well. No need to predict usage and reserve instance time in advance; the discount is simply applied progressively as you use a particular instance type more during a month.
  - kuschku 10y ago
    Why is GCP (just like AWS and Azure) still 5 times more expensive than comparable dedicated cloud services from competitors? I can get this https://www.hetzner.de/us/hosting/produkte_rootserver/ex40 https://www.hetzner.de/us/hosting/produkte_rootserver/ex40 in a few hours, with more performance than anything you offer for even 5 times the price. Same at most other dedicated hosters. Do you even ever intend to be price competitive?
stankal 10y ago
Also, there's nobody to contact at Microsoft regarding Azure billing. I was prototyping some app that used App Service, Document DB, and Notification Hub and for a few months they billed at around $10 - $20, all of a sudden it's $1,200 for a month. The app was not launched, I was the only user. There's no way to figure out why other than it's a DocumentDB charge. There's no way I'd put anything in production with Azure.
- masta 10y ago
  Did you open a support ticket, there is a category specifically for Billing issues.
  - stankal 10y ago
    Thanks, I just did. For some reason I did not see that option before.
- syamk_msft 10y ago
  If you can PM askdocdb at Microsoft and share details on your subscription, we can take a look and help you. Thanks

kefka 10y ago

Absolutely not. If anything, they are worse at hidden billing than Comcast. Then again, AWS is also pretty atrocious as well (just rear Glacier horror stories). But more people understand the pricing with AWS. I find that Azure is about 1.5x the price of similar services from AWS. I've not looked at GCE. But those are my experiences. YMMV

jedberg 10y ago
> just rear Glacier horror stories In Amazon's defense, their pricing is pretty clear and straightforward except for Glacier, which even they admit doesn't follow their pricing model for all the other services. Google's is still the best though -- they automatically give you "bulk discounts" instead of having to buy them in advance like AWS, and their general philosophy is "your cheapest option should be to finish your workload as quickly as possible", as opposed to AWS, where you have to do some acrobatics to fit into their pricing models efficiently.
rnnr 10y ago
Also, isn't AWS billing per utilization/hour? For small projects this means it is many times cheaper than Azure. Azure is more focused to enterprises than to individual devs.
- blahi 10y ago
  wat? Azure has minute billing... So does google. AWS is a mess.
  - rnnr 10y ago
    Not in Azure SQL
  - kefka 10y ago
    Yes, and if you were doing anything with the recently killed (or soon to be) RemoteApp, billing there was a disaster. Absolute horrible disaster. Overbilled to my employer because their websites did not equal to what they quoted us. They also refuse to honor enterprise contract regarding transfer (Internet2 peer). Just horrible terrible bad no good. And their MQTT service (IoT) pricing is a joke. $50/month for 400k messages a day (!second, typo) with a cap of 4k? Seriously? That's just 4.6 messages a second, WITH a data restriction that MQTT itself doesn't have. I routinely load pictures with motion to "house/frontdoor/motion/" topic in the form of a jpg. MQTT specifies nothing about said data ~ I could even store a dvd VOB for video in a topic. And this offering is for a max data of 48GB/month. To put this in perspective, a dialup modem(!) Gets a top speed of 5.2KB/s , which sustained across a 30 day month = 43.2GB I can (and have!) bought a cheap-shit VPS server and installed Mosquitto on it. I can use MQTT as the spec indicates, including Websockets and storing picture data. And it's more on the price range of $40/year, not $600/yr source: https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/pricing/details/iot-hub/ https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/pricing/details/iot-hub/
    - trevyn 10y ago
      Your dialup modem math is wrong: https://www.google.com/webhp?ie=UTF-8#q=(5.2+kilobytes%2Fsec)+*+30+days https://www.google.com/webhp?ie=UTF-8#q=(5.2+kilobytes%2Fsec... (13.48 GB)
      - kefka 10y ago
        I can only blame the... uhh..err.. uhmm... The Windows Calculator! Blast it all! :)
- UK-AL 10y ago
  Azure is per minute
craigvn 10y ago
I find the prices pretty straightforward mostly, the portal will give you an estimate of the monthly cost for all your current services. The problem is the data transfer pricing. Say you have a website that has 5000 visits a day, it is really hard to estimate your IN/OUT GB, then do the same for blob storage or other services.
praseodym 10y ago
You'd think Microsoft would be the go-to provider for SQL Server workloads, but Azure SQL is terribly expensive for some (many?) workloads. For read-intensive SQL Server workloads you'll be paying upwards of $465/mo (Premium P1 [1]) for something that can be easily handled by a beefy VM for a fraction of the price. Also, the Azure SQL pricing model links performance ('eDTUs') to storage which skews the billing model even further. [1] https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/pricing/details/sql-database/ https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/pricing/details/sql-databa...
- kefka 10y ago
  Precisely. I highlight a similar pricing breakdown with their IoT / MQTT service and their price inanities as well. As far as I can tell, this insane pricing is for the idea of "Can't go wrong with purchasing Microsoft Services".... when in actuality, you can go very much wrong.
- maglite77 10y ago
  [Disclosure: I work for Microsoft] One thing to keep in mind for Azure SQL: you are getting a guaranteed SLA [1], business continuity and full point-in-time backups (up to 30 days) [2] for that price. To compare effectively you would need to price out a comparable Always-On cluster, domain controllers, SAN storage (for replication), and backup solution + storage. [1]: https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/support/legal/sla/sql-database/v1_1/ https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/support/legal/sla/sql-data... [2]: https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/documentation/articles/sql-database-business-continuity/ https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/documentation/articles/sql...

Someone1234 10y ago

Reserved instance pricing on AWS absolutely destroys Azure. If you do on-demand on both, they look competitive, but there are ways of bringing AWS down which Azure simply cannot match.

vgt 10y ago
Have you had a chance to look at Google's Preemptible VMs? They're a fixed 70-80% off of list price. Another point is, Google's VMs are generic CPU/RAM combinations. You don't need "network optimized VMs" or "storage optimized VMs" - you simply get those things on any VM. This makes the "excess instance supply" market much more fluid and simplifies folks' lives. Happy to discuss further! (work at GCP)
- xiaomai 10y ago
  That's nice, I'm using azure for a windows vm and it's been super frustrating trying to get reasonable performance. (RAM/CPU/etc. is all great but the standard IO is so slow it's basically unusable (i'm maxing out at 10M/s (I think due to iops limitiations).
- dimfeld 10y ago
  Google's sustained use discounts for standard (non-preemptible) VMs are a huge win as well. No need to predict usage and reserve instance time in advance; the discount is simply applied progressively as you use a particular instance type more during a month.
- kuschku 10y ago
  Why is GCP (just like AWS and Azure) still 5 times more expensive than comparable dedicated cloud services from competitors? I can get this https://www.hetzner.de/us/hosting/produkte_rootserver/ex40 https://www.hetzner.de/us/hosting/produkte_rootserver/ex40 in a few hours, with more performance than anything you offer for even 5 times the price. Same at most other dedicated hosters. Do you even ever intend to be price competitive?

stankal 10y ago

Also, there's nobody to contact at Microsoft regarding Azure billing. I was prototyping some app that used App Service, Document DB, and Notification Hub and for a few months they billed at around $10 - $20, all of a sudden it's $1,200 for a month. The app was not launched, I was the only user. There's no way to figure out why other than it's a DocumentDB charge. There's no way I'd put anything in production with Azure.

masta 10y ago
Did you open a support ticket, there is a category specifically for Billing issues.
- stankal 10y ago
  Thanks, I just did. For some reason I did not see that option before.
syamk_msft 10y ago
If you can PM askdocdb at Microsoft and share details on your subscription, we can take a look and help you. Thanks