3 ms·

Sad. Seeing Russia determine the outcome of this war is frustrating. Then again it's not the US's responsibility to fix everything.

by tormeh 10y ago

pabloski 10y ago
Fix? They break everything they touch. Seriously, starting with Saddam they have created utter chaos in the ME and helped spread terrorism all over the world. But hey, Eisenhower tried to wake up we (the people) when he talked about the dangers of the military-industrial complex.
- faebi 10y ago
  Its the USA who started all this chaos in the near east and europe is the one who suffers. Nicely explained by satire show "Die Anstalt" on youtube https://youtu.be/57fMqUl-sng https://youtu.be/57fMqUl-sng (english subtitles)
  - travmatt 10y ago
    I'd argue Europe's brilliant idea to carve up the Middle East into countries intentionally designed to be sectarian is a root cause of today's problems. America took the lid off the problems, but we didn't draw the lines of Syria, Iraq, etc.
- rando444 10y ago
  Why start with Saddam? Overthrowing Mohammad Mosaddegh started a shitstorm that has been going on ever since. This is probably where Eisenhower learned the dangers of the 'military industrial complex', because the US was actually opposed to intervention in Iran until Eisenhower came to power and changed that position (on the advice of Winston Churchill)
- abysmallyideal 10y ago
  When it comes to states like the US, a military agreement or alliance doesn't mean the US will "honor it" when their allies are attacked or in need of their assistance. It only means they will consider giving some kind of aid if it suits them.
WalterSear 10y ago
Let's not forget that this was started as a proxy war over the development of oil pipelines.
- travmatt 10y ago
  Can you source that? I'd be interested in learning more.
  - dalke 10y ago
    WalterSear may be referring to a proposed gas pipeline: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qatar-Turkey_pipeline https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qatar-Turkey_pipeline .
  - WalterSear 10y ago
    "...strategic concerns, motivated by fear of expanding Iranian influence, impacted Syria primarily in relation to pipeline geopolitics. In 2009... Assad refused to sign a proposed agreement with Qatar that would run a pipeline from the latter's North field, contiguous with Iran's South Pars field, through Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Syria and on to Turkey, with a view to supply European markets - albeit crucially bypassing Russia... Instead, the following year, Assad pursued negotiations for an alternative $10 billion pipeline plan with Iran, across Iraq to Syria, that would also potentially allow Iran to supply gas to Europe from its South Pars field shared with Qatar... The Iran-Iraq-Syria pipeline plan was a "direct slap in the face" to Qatar's plans. No wonder Saudi Prince Bandar bin Sultan, in a failed attempt to bribe Russia to switch sides, told President Vladmir Putin that "whatever regime comes after" Assad, it will be "completely" in Saudi Arabia's hands and will "not sign any agreement allowing any Gulf country to transport its gas across Syria to Europe and compete with Russian gas exports", according to diplomatic sources. When Putin refused, the Prince vowed military action." https://www.theguardian.com/environment/earth-insight/2013/aug/30/syria-chemical-attack-war-intervention-oil-gas-energy-pipelines https://www.theguardian.com/environment/earth-insight/2013/a... "Don’t let anyone fool you: As we have detailed since 2013, sectarian strife in Syria has been engineered to provide cover for a war for access to oil and gas, and the power and money that come along with it." http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-09-10/competing-gas-pipelines-are-fueling-syrian-war-migrant-crisis http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-09-10/competing-gas-pipel... "An Iran-Iraq-Syria pipeline is unacceptable in the Beltway not only because US vassals lose, but most of all because in currency war terms it would bypass the petrodollar. Iranian gas from South Pars would be traded in an alternative basket of currencies." http://www.counterpunch.org/2015/12/08/syria-ultimate-pipelineistan-war/ http://www.counterpunch.org/2015/12/08/syria-ultimate-pipeli... "Many have questioned why Russia became involved in the Syrian war but often overlook the fight over natural gas. As Harvard Professor Mitchell A Orenstein and George Romer wrote last month inForeign Affairs, Russia currently supplies Europe with a quarter of the gas it uses for heating, cooking, fuel and other activities. In fact 80 per cent of the gas that Russian state-controlled company Gazprom produces is sold to Europe, so maintaining this crucial market is very important. But Europe doesn’t like being so reliant on Russia for fuel and has been trying to reduce its dependence. It’s a move that is supported by the United States as it would weaken Russian influence over Europe." http://www.news.com.au/world/middle-east/is-the-fight-over-a-gas-pipeline-fuelling-the-worlds-bloodiest-conflict/news-story/74efcba9554c10bd35e280b63a9afb74 http://www.news.com.au/world/middle-east/is-the-fight-over-a... "In 1989, Qatar and Iran began to develop the South Pars/North Dome field, which is buried 3,000 meters below the floor of the Persian Gulf. With 51 trillion cubic meters of gas and 50 billion cubic meters of liquid condensates, it is the largest natural gas field in the world. Approximately one-third of its riches lie in Iranian waters and two-thirds in Qatari ones. Since the discovery, Qatar has invested heavily in liquefied natural gas (LNG) plants and terminals that enable it to ship its gas around the world in tankers. Yet liquefaction and shipping increase total costs and, particularly as gas prices have slipped, Qatari gas has remained easily undercut in European markets by cheaper pipeline gas from Russia and elsewhere. And so, in 2009, Qatar proposed to build a pipeline to send its gas northwest via Saudi Arabia, Jordan, and Syria to Turkey, an investment of billions of dollars up front that would reduce transportation costs over the long term. However, Syrian President Bashar al Assad refused to sign the plan; Russia, which did not want to see its position in European gas markets undermined, put him under intense pressure not to." http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-secret-stupid-saudi-us-deal-on-syria/5410130 http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-secret-stupid-saudi-us-deal...

Sad. Seeing Russia determine the outcome of this war is frustrating. Then again it's not the US's responsibility to fix everything.

by tormeh 10y ago

Sad. Seeing Russia determine the outcome of this war is frustrating. Then again it's not the US's responsibility to fix everything.

pabloski 10y ago

Fix? They break everything they touch. Seriously, starting with Saddam they have created utter chaos in the ME and helped spread terrorism all over the world. But hey, Eisenhower tried to wake up we (the people) when he talked about the dangers of the military-industrial complex.

faebi 10y ago
Its the USA who started all this chaos in the near east and europe is the one who suffers. Nicely explained by satire show "Die Anstalt" on youtube https://youtu.be/57fMqUl-sng https://youtu.be/57fMqUl-sng (english subtitles)
- travmatt 10y ago
  I'd argue Europe's brilliant idea to carve up the Middle East into countries intentionally designed to be sectarian is a root cause of today's problems. America took the lid off the problems, but we didn't draw the lines of Syria, Iraq, etc.
rando444 10y ago
Why start with Saddam? Overthrowing Mohammad Mosaddegh started a shitstorm that has been going on ever since. This is probably where Eisenhower learned the dangers of the 'military industrial complex', because the US was actually opposed to intervention in Iran until Eisenhower came to power and changed that position (on the advice of Winston Churchill)
abysmallyideal 10y ago
When it comes to states like the US, a military agreement or alliance doesn't mean the US will "honor it" when their allies are attacked or in need of their assistance. It only means they will consider giving some kind of aid if it suits them.

WalterSear 10y ago

Let's not forget that this was started as a proxy war over the development of oil pipelines.

travmatt 10y ago
Can you source that? I'd be interested in learning more.
- dalke 10y ago
  WalterSear may be referring to a proposed gas pipeline: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qatar-Turkey_pipeline https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qatar-Turkey_pipeline .
- WalterSear 10y ago
  "...strategic concerns, motivated by fear of expanding Iranian influence, impacted Syria primarily in relation to pipeline geopolitics. In 2009... Assad refused to sign a proposed agreement with Qatar that would run a pipeline from the latter's North field, contiguous with Iran's South Pars field, through Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Syria and on to Turkey, with a view to supply European markets - albeit crucially bypassing Russia... Instead, the following year, Assad pursued negotiations for an alternative $10 billion pipeline plan with Iran, across Iraq to Syria, that would also potentially allow Iran to supply gas to Europe from its South Pars field shared with Qatar... The Iran-Iraq-Syria pipeline plan was a "direct slap in the face" to Qatar's plans. No wonder Saudi Prince Bandar bin Sultan, in a failed attempt to bribe Russia to switch sides, told President Vladmir Putin that "whatever regime comes after" Assad, it will be "completely" in Saudi Arabia's hands and will "not sign any agreement allowing any Gulf country to transport its gas across Syria to Europe and compete with Russian gas exports", according to diplomatic sources. When Putin refused, the Prince vowed military action." https://www.theguardian.com/environment/earth-insight/2013/aug/30/syria-chemical-attack-war-intervention-oil-gas-energy-pipelines https://www.theguardian.com/environment/earth-insight/2013/a... "Don’t let anyone fool you: As we have detailed since 2013, sectarian strife in Syria has been engineered to provide cover for a war for access to oil and gas, and the power and money that come along with it." http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-09-10/competing-gas-pipelines-are-fueling-syrian-war-migrant-crisis http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-09-10/competing-gas-pipel... "An Iran-Iraq-Syria pipeline is unacceptable in the Beltway not only because US vassals lose, but most of all because in currency war terms it would bypass the petrodollar. Iranian gas from South Pars would be traded in an alternative basket of currencies." http://www.counterpunch.org/2015/12/08/syria-ultimate-pipelineistan-war/ http://www.counterpunch.org/2015/12/08/syria-ultimate-pipeli... "Many have questioned why Russia became involved in the Syrian war but often overlook the fight over natural gas. As Harvard Professor Mitchell A Orenstein and George Romer wrote last month inForeign Affairs, Russia currently supplies Europe with a quarter of the gas it uses for heating, cooking, fuel and other activities. In fact 80 per cent of the gas that Russian state-controlled company Gazprom produces is sold to Europe, so maintaining this crucial market is very important. But Europe doesn’t like being so reliant on Russia for fuel and has been trying to reduce its dependence. It’s a move that is supported by the United States as it would weaken Russian influence over Europe." http://www.news.com.au/world/middle-east/is-the-fight-over-a-gas-pipeline-fuelling-the-worlds-bloodiest-conflict/news-story/74efcba9554c10bd35e280b63a9afb74 http://www.news.com.au/world/middle-east/is-the-fight-over-a... "In 1989, Qatar and Iran began to develop the South Pars/North Dome field, which is buried 3,000 meters below the floor of the Persian Gulf. With 51 trillion cubic meters of gas and 50 billion cubic meters of liquid condensates, it is the largest natural gas field in the world. Approximately one-third of its riches lie in Iranian waters and two-thirds in Qatari ones. Since the discovery, Qatar has invested heavily in liquefied natural gas (LNG) plants and terminals that enable it to ship its gas around the world in tankers. Yet liquefaction and shipping increase total costs and, particularly as gas prices have slipped, Qatari gas has remained easily undercut in European markets by cheaper pipeline gas from Russia and elsewhere. And so, in 2009, Qatar proposed to build a pipeline to send its gas northwest via Saudi Arabia, Jordan, and Syria to Turkey, an investment of billions of dollars up front that would reduce transportation costs over the long term. However, Syrian President Bashar al Assad refused to sign the plan; Russia, which did not want to see its position in European gas markets undermined, put him under intense pressure not to." http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-secret-stupid-saudi-us-deal-on-syria/5410130 http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-secret-stupid-saudi-us-deal...