4 ms·

Not give him your money. MBPs are not that special.

by elai 17y ago

callahad 17y ago
What else is available with a similar build quality? Anything besides ThinkPads?
- jbellis 17y ago
  Dell Studio XPS or HP Envy line are good alternatives, depending on what you need. Both are available with higher-res screens and faster (quad core i7) cpus than the mbp, for instance. The major caveats on the Envy are that it has serious, deep issues preventing Linux from running on it, and it has no displayport or dvi out for driving a 30" monitor. The Dell's biggest weakness is battery life.
  - mquander 17y ago
    Slight reality check here - I've got an i5 Envy 15 that I bought a month ago, and although it had some problems with Linux for a while, I have no difficulty running it now with Ubuntu 10.04 beta. The issues I'm aware of were: - Touchpad click buttons don't work, forcing you to double-tap to click - Weird BIOS caused both TurboBoost (the Intel extension that powers down cores and speeds up others) and ACPI to fuck up, leading to no TB and no heat management, fans ran constantly, very bad news - Buggy sleep/resume Points 2 and 3 are fixed in 2.6.33+. Point 1 can be fixed via a patch to the synaptics module, but I just use an external mouse all the time anyway. I believe you can thank this fellow for many of these fixes: http://www.chizang.net/alex/blog/2009/12/21/linux-on-the-hp-envy-15/ http://www.chizang.net/alex/blog/2009/12/21/linux-on-the-hp-...
    - jbellis 17y ago
      Yes, 2 and 3 are what I was referring to. Glad to hear those are fixed!
  - nkohari 17y ago
    I owned a Studio XPS 1645 (the Core i7 model). The construction was pretty good for Dell, and the RGBLED screen was gorgeous. However, they clearly rushed the Core i7 version to market without testing power consumption effectively. The supplied power supply was 90W, and the machine drew something like 110W under load. I returned mine, but from what I hear, Dell replaced all of the power supplies. Not sure if that fixed the issue. Although they made it right, that's the last time I'm going to buy a Dell -- particularly one built on the newest tech. I don't think the QA is there.
  - dskhatri 17y ago
    I just received my Envy 15 last night. It's a beautifully designed machine but has 2 glaring flaws: 1. The screen only tilts to ~105-110 degrees. This makes it tough to use on your lap or on a short table (commonly found in coffee shops sadly). 2. The AC-DC power supply is bulky. The plug has 3 pins too. Earth is not needed for laptop power supplies! There is no electric shock risk for a laptop user! I was dismayed to find such a hideous power supply bundled with this laptop.
    - OmarIsmail 17y ago
      I have the 'first gen' Envy 15 and absolutely love it. If I were to buy a new laptop now I'd go with the new 15" MBP though. The big thing is in the battery life. Sure you have 5-6 hours on the Envy but that's with the big and heavy battery slice attached. The MBP will I'm sure go over 7 hours stock. Still, I bought my Envy about 6 months ago, so I'm not upset (at least that's what I'll tell myself).
      - jbellis 17y ago
        I get about 4h on my 10-days-old mbp battery, fwiw. Apple's benchmarks are as unrealistically optimistic as everyone else's. (I complained about this to a long-time mac user, and he said "You're probably using it with the display on.")
    - deleted 17y ago
      [deleted]
- andymoe 17y ago
  Maybe the build quality of the thinkpads used to compair but the mbp is much better now and the lenovo's worse. I own a last gen mbp and have also placed 20-30 lenovo's at clients in the past. The are not even close these days.
- jleyank 17y ago
  I've been using Apple gear since '90 or so, and my current (2008) MBP seems to be the lemon of the set. So far: blew a fan, DVD drive and shorted out the battery. Thought the Airport card was toast this morning, but it seems to have come back. Yeah, it's just a single data point, but when a 12" Powerbook is still going strong (albeit slowly), the series of fails in my latest laptop is depressing. I really, really hope it's a one-off.
  - ghshephard 17y ago
    Interesting - I have the same anecdote - I have purchased _three_ generations of Macintosh Laptops - 2008, 2005, 2002 - And the last two, unfortunately, have been lemons. Interesting failure pattern - overheating resulting in CPU stalling resulting in persistent Spinning-beach-ball of Death. The 2008 Airport dies, sporadically, but it has had a good run for the last 3-4 months, so I no longer carry my USB-WiFi dongle (Amazing that they even make one for Macs) On the flip side, I'm telling myself that the last five years of misery will be worth it when it feels so good to upgrade to a laptop that is flawless (fingers crossed) - think of how amazingly good it will feel to have applications launch, consistently, within 30 seconds. :-) (Regardless, even with the weird pain, I've never even considered switching back to Windows Laptops. CMD+Space, terminal, Enter is just too perfect to consider doing so.)
- aubergene 17y ago
  I think the Sony Z series looks pretty good, quite lightweight, good keyboard, good speed.

Not give him your money. MBPs are not that special.

by elai 17y ago

Not give him your money. MBPs are not that special.

callahad 17y ago

What else is available with a similar build quality? Anything besides ThinkPads?

jbellis 17y ago
Dell Studio XPS or HP Envy line are good alternatives, depending on what you need. Both are available with higher-res screens and faster (quad core i7) cpus than the mbp, for instance. The major caveats on the Envy are that it has serious, deep issues preventing Linux from running on it, and it has no displayport or dvi out for driving a 30" monitor. The Dell's biggest weakness is battery life.
- mquander 17y ago
  Slight reality check here - I've got an i5 Envy 15 that I bought a month ago, and although it had some problems with Linux for a while, I have no difficulty running it now with Ubuntu 10.04 beta. The issues I'm aware of were: - Touchpad click buttons don't work, forcing you to double-tap to click - Weird BIOS caused both TurboBoost (the Intel extension that powers down cores and speeds up others) and ACPI to fuck up, leading to no TB and no heat management, fans ran constantly, very bad news - Buggy sleep/resume Points 2 and 3 are fixed in 2.6.33+. Point 1 can be fixed via a patch to the synaptics module, but I just use an external mouse all the time anyway. I believe you can thank this fellow for many of these fixes: http://www.chizang.net/alex/blog/2009/12/21/linux-on-the-hp-envy-15/ http://www.chizang.net/alex/blog/2009/12/21/linux-on-the-hp-...
  - jbellis 17y ago
    Yes, 2 and 3 are what I was referring to. Glad to hear those are fixed!
- nkohari 17y ago
  I owned a Studio XPS 1645 (the Core i7 model). The construction was pretty good for Dell, and the RGBLED screen was gorgeous. However, they clearly rushed the Core i7 version to market without testing power consumption effectively. The supplied power supply was 90W, and the machine drew something like 110W under load. I returned mine, but from what I hear, Dell replaced all of the power supplies. Not sure if that fixed the issue. Although they made it right, that's the last time I'm going to buy a Dell -- particularly one built on the newest tech. I don't think the QA is there.
- dskhatri 17y ago
  I just received my Envy 15 last night. It's a beautifully designed machine but has 2 glaring flaws: 1. The screen only tilts to ~105-110 degrees. This makes it tough to use on your lap or on a short table (commonly found in coffee shops sadly). 2. The AC-DC power supply is bulky. The plug has 3 pins too. Earth is not needed for laptop power supplies! There is no electric shock risk for a laptop user! I was dismayed to find such a hideous power supply bundled with this laptop.
  - OmarIsmail 17y ago
    I have the 'first gen' Envy 15 and absolutely love it. If I were to buy a new laptop now I'd go with the new 15" MBP though. The big thing is in the battery life. Sure you have 5-6 hours on the Envy but that's with the big and heavy battery slice attached. The MBP will I'm sure go over 7 hours stock. Still, I bought my Envy about 6 months ago, so I'm not upset (at least that's what I'll tell myself).
    - jbellis 17y ago
      I get about 4h on my 10-days-old mbp battery, fwiw. Apple's benchmarks are as unrealistically optimistic as everyone else's. (I complained about this to a long-time mac user, and he said "You're probably using it with the display on.")
  - deleted 17y ago
    [deleted]
andymoe 17y ago
Maybe the build quality of the thinkpads used to compair but the mbp is much better now and the lenovo's worse. I own a last gen mbp and have also placed 20-30 lenovo's at clients in the past. The are not even close these days.
jleyank 17y ago
I've been using Apple gear since '90 or so, and my current (2008) MBP seems to be the lemon of the set. So far: blew a fan, DVD drive and shorted out the battery. Thought the Airport card was toast this morning, but it seems to have come back. Yeah, it's just a single data point, but when a 12" Powerbook is still going strong (albeit slowly), the series of fails in my latest laptop is depressing. I really, really hope it's a one-off.
- ghshephard 17y ago
  Interesting - I have the same anecdote - I have purchased _three_ generations of Macintosh Laptops - 2008, 2005, 2002 - And the last two, unfortunately, have been lemons. Interesting failure pattern - overheating resulting in CPU stalling resulting in persistent Spinning-beach-ball of Death. The 2008 Airport dies, sporadically, but it has had a good run for the last 3-4 months, so I no longer carry my USB-WiFi dongle (Amazing that they even make one for Macs) On the flip side, I'm telling myself that the last five years of misery will be worth it when it feels so good to upgrade to a laptop that is flawless (fingers crossed) - think of how amazingly good it will feel to have applications launch, consistently, within 30 seconds. :-) (Regardless, even with the weird pain, I've never even considered switching back to Windows Laptops. CMD+Space, terminal, Enter is just too perfect to consider doing so.)
aubergene 17y ago
I think the Sony Z series looks pretty good, quite lightweight, good keyboard, good speed.