5 ms·

My first thought: "I wonder what the economics are like, re: cryptocurrency mining?" My second thought: "I wonder if Amazon use their 'idle' capacity to mine c

by phs318u 10y ago

My first thought: "I wonder what the economics are like, re: cryptocurrency mining?" My second thought: "I wonder if Amazon use their 'idle' capacity to mine cryptocurrency?" With respect to my second thought, at their scale, and at the cost they'd be paying for electricity, it could quite possibly be a good hedge.

dharma1 10y ago
They sell their idle capacity at spot prices. I am really happy they have upgraded the GPU instances
hueving 10y ago
As far as I understand it, the only way to profitably mine bitcoin is to have super cheap power and ASICs specific to bitcoin mining. Essentially, GPUs won't cut it because you're competing with Chinese miners using ASICs attached almost directly to dirty, cheap electricity generation.
- askmike 10y ago
  You are right about Bitcoin specifically, but there is a second market for altcoins which use different PoW algorithms [0]. For a lot of these ASICs are either not on the market, or not economically feasible, in which cases GPUs still dominate. But most of these markets are very small compared to Bitcoin. [0] https://whattomine.com/ https://whattomine.com/
- kobeya 10y ago
  He didn't say bitcoin.
- cloudjacker 10y ago
  You don't understand it. Mine other cryptocurrencies that are profitable, or may become profitable. It is VERY, as in EXTREMELY, profitable to mine large stakes in cryptocurrencies that the market hasn't discovered yet. Especially ones that aren't even listed on an exchange yet and mining is the only way to earn it. The Darkcoin (now renamed to the politically non-threatening name DASH) instamine was a notoriously profitable use of GPU clusters on AWS.
  - hueving 10y ago
    Don't claim I don't understand it when I was clearly talking about the economics of bitcoin. Also, if you are paying to mine currencies that don't have an exchange value yet, you are just speculating. The mining isn't profitable at that point because the currency has no value. It's just as likely that you chose to mine a dud. It's exactly the same thing as opening a copper mine at a loss and hoarding the concentrate hoping that it will gain value.
    - cloudjacker 10y ago
      > you are just speculating you say that like its a bad thing it is a very profitable endeavor
- petertodd 10y ago
  FWIW it appears that essentially all the Chinese mining is now done with "standed" hydroelectricity out in the middle of nowhere; even coal is too expensive to be competitive.
DonHopkins 10y ago
Fuck bitcoins. I want to know how many electric sheep [1] this beast can breed per second! [1] http://www.electricsheep.org/ http://www.electricsheep.org/
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
010a 10y ago
On one hand, normal GPU mining is practically never efficient with respect to the cost of electricity. Even in a hyper-efficient datacenter, Bitcoin mining is now dominated by thousands of ASIC miners who are running hardware a hundredth the cost of GPUs at 10x+ performance. But on the other hand, these machines aren't just sitting there powered off when they aren't provisioned. They have to keep them warm so they provision ultra quick. So maybe there is some level of mining they could accomplish with their "idle" cycles, given the efficiency of the datacenter, the power of their GPUs, and the price of Bitcoin, which would be profitable. I don't know.
- ddorian43 10y ago
  Can use other types of coins where gpu is still ok.
  - synaesthesisx 10y ago
    This would work well for eCoin...
- phs318u 10y ago
  As others have pointed out there are still non-btc crypto-currencies that are worth GPU or even CPU mining[1]. But they don't even have to be making a raw profit vs the electricity they are consuming. If, as you say, the spare capacity must be kept warm anyway, then they only need to be profitable vs the delta of electricity consumption between idle and fans blowing 100%. So whatever capacity is left beyond the fixed and spot market _could_ still be earning them something. [1] http://cryptomining-blog.com/6090-crypto-coins-to-check-out-for-cpu-mining/ http://cryptomining-blog.com/6090-crypto-coins-to-check-out-... Edit: fixed spelling.

by phs318u 10y ago

dharma1 10y ago

They sell their idle capacity at spot prices. I am really happy they have upgraded the GPU instances

hueving 10y ago

As far as I understand it, the only way to profitably mine bitcoin is to have super cheap power and ASICs specific to bitcoin mining. Essentially, GPUs won't cut it because you're competing with Chinese miners using ASICs attached almost directly to dirty, cheap electricity generation.

askmike 10y ago
You are right about Bitcoin specifically, but there is a second market for altcoins which use different PoW algorithms [0]. For a lot of these ASICs are either not on the market, or not economically feasible, in which cases GPUs still dominate. But most of these markets are very small compared to Bitcoin. [0] https://whattomine.com/ https://whattomine.com/
kobeya 10y ago
He didn't say bitcoin.
cloudjacker 10y ago
You don't understand it. Mine other cryptocurrencies that are profitable, or may become profitable. It is VERY, as in EXTREMELY, profitable to mine large stakes in cryptocurrencies that the market hasn't discovered yet. Especially ones that aren't even listed on an exchange yet and mining is the only way to earn it. The Darkcoin (now renamed to the politically non-threatening name DASH) instamine was a notoriously profitable use of GPU clusters on AWS.
- hueving 10y ago
  Don't claim I don't understand it when I was clearly talking about the economics of bitcoin. Also, if you are paying to mine currencies that don't have an exchange value yet, you are just speculating. The mining isn't profitable at that point because the currency has no value. It's just as likely that you chose to mine a dud. It's exactly the same thing as opening a copper mine at a loss and hoarding the concentrate hoping that it will gain value.
  - cloudjacker 10y ago
    > you are just speculating you say that like its a bad thing it is a very profitable endeavor
petertodd 10y ago
FWIW it appears that essentially all the Chinese mining is now done with "standed" hydroelectricity out in the middle of nowhere; even coal is too expensive to be competitive.

DonHopkins 10y ago

Fuck bitcoins. I want to know how many electric sheep [1] this beast can breed per second! [1] http://www.electricsheep.org/ http://www.electricsheep.org/

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

010a 10y ago

On one hand, normal GPU mining is practically never efficient with respect to the cost of electricity. Even in a hyper-efficient datacenter, Bitcoin mining is now dominated by thousands of ASIC miners who are running hardware a hundredth the cost of GPUs at 10x+ performance. But on the other hand, these machines aren't just sitting there powered off when they aren't provisioned. They have to keep them warm so they provision ultra quick. So maybe there is some level of mining they could accomplish with their "idle" cycles, given the efficiency of the datacenter, the power of their GPUs, and the price of Bitcoin, which would be profitable. I don't know.

ddorian43 10y ago
Can use other types of coins where gpu is still ok.
- synaesthesisx 10y ago
  This would work well for eCoin...
phs318u 10y ago
As others have pointed out there are still non-btc crypto-currencies that are worth GPU or even CPU mining[1]. But they don't even have to be making a raw profit vs the electricity they are consuming. If, as you say, the spare capacity must be kept warm anyway, then they only need to be profitable vs the delta of electricity consumption between idle and fans blowing 100%. So whatever capacity is left beyond the fixed and spot market _could_ still be earning them something. [1] http://cryptomining-blog.com/6090-crypto-coins-to-check-out-for-cpu-mining/ http://cryptomining-blog.com/6090-crypto-coins-to-check-out-... Edit: fixed spelling.