5 ms·

Though there was more male dialogue than female on the show, the men were constantly portrayed as stupid, weak, aggressive, drunk, selfish, not responsible...

pixelbath 10y ago
I believe this cuts right to the heart of the matter; Simpsons is a humorous show, and stupid characters who say stupid things are humorous.
Frondo 10y ago
And the women were also weak, whiny, indifferent or overzealous-- Everyone is flawed on that show, even ol' Painty Can Ned.
- mikeash 10y ago
  There are some flattering male characters, too. Smithers is loyal, smart, ultra-competent, and his only real (albeit gigantic) flaw is being utterly blinded by love. Doctor Hibbert finds humor in unfortunate situations and is sometimes a bit of a mercenary, but he's highly competent and generally kind. Apu is a successful and extremely hard-working businessman whose catchphrase involves being polite to his customers, although he also tends to screw them over. Most of the male (and female) characters are ridiculous, because the show is fundamentally about ridiculous people. But that's not the only kind of character they have.
  - asgardiator 10y ago
    Smithers is literally the archetypal sycophant.
    - mikeash 10y ago
      I don't think that's true. A sycophant is motivated by the desire for advancement, and is typically insincere. Smithers is sincere and motivated by love, which makes him much more interesting.
  - jonathankoren 10y ago
    Apu is a stereotype. Now granted, he's on a show filled with stereotypes, and he's not always portrayed negatively, but he is still a stereotype. (In all honesty, sitcoms are all filled with stereotypes.) Smithers in the archetypical yes-man. Dr. Hibbert isn't so much a stereotype as much as a parody of Dr Huxtable.
- nerfhammer 10y ago
  Even if they had their own flaws, Lisa and Marge being morally superior to Homer and Bart is a long-running premise of the show.
  - acqq 10y ago
    > morally superior I'd say, totally superior, this was in 2000: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bart_to_the_Future https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bart_to_the_Future "Lisa has become the (first female) President of the United States and tries to get the country out of financial trouble." And I don't consider that "morality" was the major aspect of Lisa's superiority.
    - SerpentJoe 10y ago
      Bart becomes chief justice of the Supreme Court in the episode "Itchy & Scratchy: The Movie".
  - strictnein 10y ago
    And Maggie
  - rtpg 10y ago
    I guess so? Marge and Lisa both have major ticks/obsessions that kick in, just like the other two. When the plot is about Home and Bart, the other two play counterpoint. But the opposite is true. Homer just ends up getting the main role so often that we assume that to be the default state of the universe.
2bitencryption 10y ago
Not to mention the voice cast is mostly male, made even more lopsided by the fact that the female voice actresses mostly do only one voice, whereas the male voice actors do TONS. Which is just how it goes. It's unfortunate but you can't strike a 50/50 balance. Even for side-characters written as female in the script, they're going to become male during production because you don't have female voice actresses who can make a "different" voice; it would just sound like Lisa or Marge. Really only Bart's voice actress can do it (she does Nelson, too, who sounds very different).
- winstonewert 10y ago
  curious, is it a biological neccesity that female voice actresses can't do as many voices as a mail voice actress, or is there something else going on?
  - Larrikin 10y ago
    In Japanese anime, the vast majority of characters, male and female, are done by female voice actors.
    - Zikes 10y ago
      The Japanese language is fairly different from English, so much so that it can be synthesized so well that they have entirely virtual pop music stars. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vocaloid#Singer_Library https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vocaloid#Singer_Library
      - daeken 10y ago
        Vocaloid's English support has gotten absolutely fantastic. If you're curious, here are a couple of my favorites: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMc4kw45e5g https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMc4kw45e5g https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XmifuQvFu8M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XmifuQvFu8M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQKGUgOfD8U https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQKGUgOfD8U They're not for everyone, and the voices are still mechanical, but I've become a huge fan of English Vocaloid, especially Gumi.

pixelbath 10y ago

I believe this cuts right to the heart of the matter; Simpsons is a humorous show, and stupid characters who say stupid things are humorous.

Frondo 10y ago

And the women were also weak, whiny, indifferent or overzealous-- Everyone is flawed on that show, even ol' Painty Can Ned.

mikeash 10y ago
There are some flattering male characters, too. Smithers is loyal, smart, ultra-competent, and his only real (albeit gigantic) flaw is being utterly blinded by love. Doctor Hibbert finds humor in unfortunate situations and is sometimes a bit of a mercenary, but he's highly competent and generally kind. Apu is a successful and extremely hard-working businessman whose catchphrase involves being polite to his customers, although he also tends to screw them over. Most of the male (and female) characters are ridiculous, because the show is fundamentally about ridiculous people. But that's not the only kind of character they have.
- asgardiator 10y ago
  Smithers is literally the archetypal sycophant.
  - mikeash 10y ago
    I don't think that's true. A sycophant is motivated by the desire for advancement, and is typically insincere. Smithers is sincere and motivated by love, which makes him much more interesting.
- jonathankoren 10y ago
  Apu is a stereotype. Now granted, he's on a show filled with stereotypes, and he's not always portrayed negatively, but he is still a stereotype. (In all honesty, sitcoms are all filled with stereotypes.) Smithers in the archetypical yes-man. Dr. Hibbert isn't so much a stereotype as much as a parody of Dr Huxtable.
nerfhammer 10y ago
Even if they had their own flaws, Lisa and Marge being morally superior to Homer and Bart is a long-running premise of the show.
- acqq 10y ago
  > morally superior I'd say, totally superior, this was in 2000: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bart_to_the_Future https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bart_to_the_Future "Lisa has become the (first female) President of the United States and tries to get the country out of financial trouble." And I don't consider that "morality" was the major aspect of Lisa's superiority.
  - SerpentJoe 10y ago
    Bart becomes chief justice of the Supreme Court in the episode "Itchy & Scratchy: The Movie".
- strictnein 10y ago
  And Maggie
- rtpg 10y ago
  I guess so? Marge and Lisa both have major ticks/obsessions that kick in, just like the other two. When the plot is about Home and Bart, the other two play counterpoint. But the opposite is true. Homer just ends up getting the main role so often that we assume that to be the default state of the universe.

2bitencryption 10y ago

Not to mention the voice cast is mostly male, made even more lopsided by the fact that the female voice actresses mostly do only one voice, whereas the male voice actors do TONS. Which is just how it goes. It's unfortunate but you can't strike a 50/50 balance. Even for side-characters written as female in the script, they're going to become male during production because you don't have female voice actresses who can make a "different" voice; it would just sound like Lisa or Marge. Really only Bart's voice actress can do it (she does Nelson, too, who sounds very different).

winstonewert 10y ago
curious, is it a biological neccesity that female voice actresses can't do as many voices as a mail voice actress, or is there something else going on?
- Larrikin 10y ago
  In Japanese anime, the vast majority of characters, male and female, are done by female voice actors.
  - Zikes 10y ago
    The Japanese language is fairly different from English, so much so that it can be synthesized so well that they have entirely virtual pop music stars. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vocaloid#Singer_Library https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vocaloid#Singer_Library
    - daeken 10y ago
      Vocaloid's English support has gotten absolutely fantastic. If you're curious, here are a couple of my favorites: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMc4kw45e5g https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMc4kw45e5g https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XmifuQvFu8M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XmifuQvFu8M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQKGUgOfD8U https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQKGUgOfD8U They're not for everyone, and the voices are still mechanical, but I've become a huge fan of English Vocaloid, especially Gumi.