7 ms·

There is a growing market for "dumb phones" among those of us that are disillusioned with the smartphone lifestyle. It's not enormous, but it's out there. Black

There is a growing market for "dumb phones" among those of us that are disillusioned with the smartphone lifestyle. It's not enormous, but it's out there. Blackberry needs to target them. If you buy a dumb phone, you not only give up the life-sucking abyss of social media and mobile gaming, but you also give up decent cameras and useful tools like navigation, group messages, and keyboard typing. For those that want to escape the hole of smartphone existence, there is a horrible trade-off to be made. Basic tools we are used to having must be given up just for us to escape mobile app hell. It shouldn't be that way. I want a Blackberry that allows me to group message, use a mobile browser, use GPS navigation, take great photos, and type on their excellent physical keyboard without any of the other temptations that come with smartphones. As a bonus, I would love for it to be super secure. If they created a device for me that did that, I would pay them so much money.

alex_c 10y ago
>Blackberry needs to target them. Why? Dumb phones are more or less a commodity - margins are tiny, and volumes are likely small. If Blackberry lost at the high-end smartphone game, then switching to enterprise security or whatever they're working on makes way more sense than shipping a few hundred thousand units of $100 dumb phones.
- camelNotation 10y ago
  If you read my full post, I'm arguing for them to change the paradigm of the "dumb phone." A dumb phone as it stands now is a commodity. I'm arguing that there exists an untapped market of people who want a hybrid, capable of filling the multi-functional tool role of a smartphone WITHOUT the focus on social media, video, music, and other entertainment roles. Why do I need to buy a flagship smartphone to get the best camera? Why do I need to buy a smartphone to get group messages? Why do I need to buy a smartphone to use my phone as a flashlight or navigate with Google Maps? Why do I need to buy a smartphone to type on an intuitive keyboard? I'm not a teenager. I want a productivity device, not a gaming system or a miniature television or a twitter feed.
  - laumars 10y ago
    There's already a pretty wide spectrum of smart phones on the market. You don't have to spend half your monthly income on a handset to get navigation, messaging, etc.
    - camelNotation 10y ago
      True, but then you sacrifice other features in the package. You can't pay with NFC on a cheap phone. The cameras suck on cheap phones. The screen quality sucks. The build quality sucks. There are tradeoffs if you just go cheap. I would pay flagship prices for a hybrid phone that focused on productivity and ignored entertainment.
      - laumars 10y ago
        Android and Apple do also focus on productivity as well as entertainment. It sounds like what you're asking for is basically a high end phone but only supporting a subset of apps and a slide out keyboard. This sounds like commercial suicide in my opinion. As much as I'd love to see more handsets with physical keyboard, they never seem to sell well enough for manufacturers to invest in releasing more models. And I really don't know where you would draw the line with which apps to allow and which not to. There'll always be someone with slightly different requirements who would refuse to buy the handset because application x or y wasn't available. I just can't see how your preferences would equate to a big enough market for Blackberry to make any money.
        camelNotation 10y ago
        > "As much as I'd love to see more handsets with physical keyboard, they never seem to sell well enough for manufacturers to invest in releasing more models." Because like the Priv, they attach keyboards to massive screens. Those screens aren't necessary in a productivity phone. They make it unwieldy and ridiculous to use. The form factor of a Blackberry Classic is all you need, just integrate with Android.
laumars 10y ago
What you described there is a middle ground few people want. Those that buy "dumb" phones do so because they want to uncomplicate the basics. eg a real keypad for dialing. Those that want GPS, a web browser and group messaging want a smart phone. The simplest solution if you don't want social networks et al is to just not install them. Or if you want to avoid "app hell" is to not install mobile apps for websites. These days the only 3rd party apps I commonly use is Google Authenticator, Facebook, Subsonic and LG TV Remote (I have a 2 year old so my actual TV remote often becomes an item of folklore). Even in the case of YouTube I often find myself using the YouTube mobile website instead of the app.
- camelNotation 10y ago
  I'm not sure why it makes more sense for a company like ZTE or OnePlus to sell a handful of cheap flagships as opposed to one of these smaller firms producing the hybrid niche device I describe.
  - laumars 10y ago
    I think you answered your own question when you said "niche device". Cheap flagships would naturally have a bigger market than an expensive smartphone with crippled app support.
    - camelNotation 10y ago
      I don't think you understand the market I'm describing.
riyadparvez 10y ago
Just out of curiosity, why can't you uninstall the apps that you deem unproductive or distracting? I have uninstalled all the social, distracting, unproductive apps from my smartphone. Granted, most smartphones don't have keyboards. Other than that you should be ok with a smartphone.
- graeme 10y ago
  There's a difference between "impossible to install" and "must restrain self from installing". Not OP, but I'm guessing that's where they're coming from. I've had situations where "impossible" was significantly more productive for me than "difficult".
nixos 10y ago
So you're asking for a smartphone without apps. Try locking your playstore.
Rhod3s 10y ago
Use a Windows Phone. It's almost everything that you are looking for, except for the physical keyboard. The Lumia line has some pretty good phones and you get all the basics of a modern smartphone (good cameras, email, browser, GPS, etc.) but the app store doesn't have a lot of apps to distract you.
- Scottn1 10y ago
  +1 My Lumia 735 does all the modern basics very well and everything I need in a phone. But the App store is like a ghost town so very little to distract you. It has some popular apps, but even then they not updated or poorly done to same ones on iOS/Droid. I am coming from two years with a Blackberry Z10 myself and using WM10 now for 6 months has pleasantly made me a believer in it. It is simple, smooth and pretty well thought out. I am really surprised it doesn't gain more ground, but the world is all about APPS rather than the technical merits of the OS (otherwise BB10 would have become more popular). The WM10 virtual keyboard is the best stock i've used and even beats the 3rd party ones i've tried on droid. It has awesome word prediction and built in swipe typing for those that prefer that. Cortana is VERY well done and again easily competes with Siri (I've actually had to whip out my phone a few times to quickly just find what my wife was asking for on her iPhone). Edge browser is fast and nimble (plus will be getting extensions soon I hope). Maps also is good enough. But best feature, to me, is how well WM10 ties into your Microsoft life; Office/Outlook plus Onedrive. Just go through the settings to turn off any privacy stuff you may have concern with and it is a good modern phone for someone like me who has zero social media life other than texts. You can also get even a flagship phone used pretty cheap now as well. I am looking forward to the new Surface phone.
Zigurd 10y ago
There are millions, maybe hundreds of millions of feature phones of every type out there that you can get for pennies, used, in fine condition. Many times more than there are buyers for those phones. There is no reason to make a new feature phone for the developed world market. I have a shoebox full of them.
st3v3r 10y ago
Why would that be any better than just buying a regular smartphone, and not installing apps? Further, while you say you'd pay them a lot of money, I really doubt anyone else would.
huffmsa 10y ago
So don't download games and social media. The Good Lord gave you free will, exercise it.
serge2k 10y ago
> Blackberry needs to target them We have a failing hardware business, so lets fix that by targeting a small market segment which also happens to have nothing to do with our core business. Makes sense.
ClassyJacket 10y ago
Couldn't you just not install those apps you don't want?
dingo_bat 10y ago
Anybody can escape app hell. Just don't download apps. Whatever happened to self restraint and discipline? It's like saying I'm gonna throw my TV out because I'm watching too much tv. The correct solution is watch less tv.

alex_c 10y ago

>Blackberry needs to target them. Why? Dumb phones are more or less a commodity - margins are tiny, and volumes are likely small. If Blackberry lost at the high-end smartphone game, then switching to enterprise security or whatever they're working on makes way more sense than shipping a few hundred thousand units of $100 dumb phones.

camelNotation 10y ago
If you read my full post, I'm arguing for them to change the paradigm of the "dumb phone." A dumb phone as it stands now is a commodity. I'm arguing that there exists an untapped market of people who want a hybrid, capable of filling the multi-functional tool role of a smartphone WITHOUT the focus on social media, video, music, and other entertainment roles. Why do I need to buy a flagship smartphone to get the best camera? Why do I need to buy a smartphone to get group messages? Why do I need to buy a smartphone to use my phone as a flashlight or navigate with Google Maps? Why do I need to buy a smartphone to type on an intuitive keyboard? I'm not a teenager. I want a productivity device, not a gaming system or a miniature television or a twitter feed.
- laumars 10y ago
  There's already a pretty wide spectrum of smart phones on the market. You don't have to spend half your monthly income on a handset to get navigation, messaging, etc.
  - camelNotation 10y ago
    True, but then you sacrifice other features in the package. You can't pay with NFC on a cheap phone. The cameras suck on cheap phones. The screen quality sucks. The build quality sucks. There are tradeoffs if you just go cheap. I would pay flagship prices for a hybrid phone that focused on productivity and ignored entertainment.
    - laumars 10y ago
      Android and Apple do also focus on productivity as well as entertainment. It sounds like what you're asking for is basically a high end phone but only supporting a subset of apps and a slide out keyboard. This sounds like commercial suicide in my opinion. As much as I'd love to see more handsets with physical keyboard, they never seem to sell well enough for manufacturers to invest in releasing more models. And I really don't know where you would draw the line with which apps to allow and which not to. There'll always be someone with slightly different requirements who would refuse to buy the handset because application x or y wasn't available. I just can't see how your preferences would equate to a big enough market for Blackberry to make any money.
      - camelNotation 10y ago
        > "As much as I'd love to see more handsets with physical keyboard, they never seem to sell well enough for manufacturers to invest in releasing more models." Because like the Priv, they attach keyboards to massive screens. Those screens aren't necessary in a productivity phone. They make it unwieldy and ridiculous to use. The form factor of a Blackberry Classic is all you need, just integrate with Android.

laumars 10y ago

What you described there is a middle ground few people want. Those that buy "dumb" phones do so because they want to uncomplicate the basics. eg a real keypad for dialing. Those that want GPS, a web browser and group messaging want a smart phone. The simplest solution if you don't want social networks et al is to just not install them. Or if you want to avoid "app hell" is to not install mobile apps for websites. These days the only 3rd party apps I commonly use is Google Authenticator, Facebook, Subsonic and LG TV Remote (I have a 2 year old so my actual TV remote often becomes an item of folklore). Even in the case of YouTube I often find myself using the YouTube mobile website instead of the app.

camelNotation 10y ago
I'm not sure why it makes more sense for a company like ZTE or OnePlus to sell a handful of cheap flagships as opposed to one of these smaller firms producing the hybrid niche device I describe.
- laumars 10y ago
  I think you answered your own question when you said "niche device". Cheap flagships would naturally have a bigger market than an expensive smartphone with crippled app support.
  - camelNotation 10y ago
    I don't think you understand the market I'm describing.

riyadparvez 10y ago

Just out of curiosity, why can't you uninstall the apps that you deem unproductive or distracting? I have uninstalled all the social, distracting, unproductive apps from my smartphone. Granted, most smartphones don't have keyboards. Other than that you should be ok with a smartphone.

graeme 10y ago
There's a difference between "impossible to install" and "must restrain self from installing". Not OP, but I'm guessing that's where they're coming from. I've had situations where "impossible" was significantly more productive for me than "difficult".

nixos 10y ago

So you're asking for a smartphone without apps. Try locking your playstore.

Rhod3s 10y ago

Use a Windows Phone. It's almost everything that you are looking for, except for the physical keyboard. The Lumia line has some pretty good phones and you get all the basics of a modern smartphone (good cameras, email, browser, GPS, etc.) but the app store doesn't have a lot of apps to distract you.

Scottn1 10y ago
+1 My Lumia 735 does all the modern basics very well and everything I need in a phone. But the App store is like a ghost town so very little to distract you. It has some popular apps, but even then they not updated or poorly done to same ones on iOS/Droid. I am coming from two years with a Blackberry Z10 myself and using WM10 now for 6 months has pleasantly made me a believer in it. It is simple, smooth and pretty well thought out. I am really surprised it doesn't gain more ground, but the world is all about APPS rather than the technical merits of the OS (otherwise BB10 would have become more popular). The WM10 virtual keyboard is the best stock i've used and even beats the 3rd party ones i've tried on droid. It has awesome word prediction and built in swipe typing for those that prefer that. Cortana is VERY well done and again easily competes with Siri (I've actually had to whip out my phone a few times to quickly just find what my wife was asking for on her iPhone). Edge browser is fast and nimble (plus will be getting extensions soon I hope). Maps also is good enough. But best feature, to me, is how well WM10 ties into your Microsoft life; Office/Outlook plus Onedrive. Just go through the settings to turn off any privacy stuff you may have concern with and it is a good modern phone for someone like me who has zero social media life other than texts. You can also get even a flagship phone used pretty cheap now as well. I am looking forward to the new Surface phone.

Zigurd 10y ago

There are millions, maybe hundreds of millions of feature phones of every type out there that you can get for pennies, used, in fine condition. Many times more than there are buyers for those phones. There is no reason to make a new feature phone for the developed world market. I have a shoebox full of them.

st3v3r 10y ago

Why would that be any better than just buying a regular smartphone, and not installing apps? Further, while you say you'd pay them a lot of money, I really doubt anyone else would.

huffmsa 10y ago

So don't download games and social media. The Good Lord gave you free will, exercise it.

serge2k 10y ago

> Blackberry needs to target them We have a failing hardware business, so lets fix that by targeting a small market segment which also happens to have nothing to do with our core business. Makes sense.

ClassyJacket 10y ago

Couldn't you just not install those apps you don't want?

dingo_bat 10y ago

Anybody can escape app hell. Just don't download apps. Whatever happened to self restraint and discipline? It's like saying I'm gonna throw my TV out because I'm watching too much tv. The correct solution is watch less tv.