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Just stop with the status symbol crap. I didn't buy a mac to be like everyone else. I bought it because the hardware is solid. For example the keyboard doesn't

Just stop with the status symbol crap. I didn't buy a mac to be like everyone else. I bought it because the hardware is solid. For example the keyboard doesn't flex a half inch like nearly every plastic piece of crap windows laptop out there.

Inconel 10y ago
You may not have bought a Mac to be like everyone else but that doesn't necessarily mean that many others aren't buying Apple products at least partially due to brand status and social signaling. Edit: I don't mind the downvotes if I have said something stupid but could I get some clarification here? I'm typing this on a MacBook so I clearly like Apple products but it seems like branding and marketing are fairly important to Apple, otherwise they probably wouldn't spend billions of dollars on ad campaigns.
- striking 10y ago
  In my view (though I did not downvote you) I felt you brought little to a conversation about tools for professionals. Sure, Apple doesn't make good pro tools anymore, but the interesting part is the anymore. It used to be that they made incredible workstations with really interesting gear, capturing a sort of "pro consumer" market. Maybe your point was that the financials are no longer there to support pro gear or creativity or even OS X as a whole because phones make them more money. If it was, though, you didn't express it. And I agree with the fact that many people are buying them because they're simply status symbols, but many more people buy them because they see it as the easiest choice. Your (average, run-of-the-mill) grandma's not going to be able to choose one of many Android phones unless her grandson tells her which one to pick. At that point she might just walk into an Apple store and out with a new phone. If that was part of your point, you also didn't express that. So I think you're losing points because your points aren't all too accurate or visible (at least from my point of view) and because, even if they were, they have very little to do about the deprecation of Apple's tooling for semi-/pro users.
  - Inconel 10y ago
    Thanks for the detailed response, I very much appreciate it. Looking back, I suppose you are correct that my comment didn't add much to the conversation. In my defense though, my comment was a response to another poster who seemed to imply that no one buys Apple products due to it being a status symbol, at least that's how I interpret the line "Just stop with the status symbol crap". Said poster then uses their own reason for purchasing a Mac to completely dismiss the possibility that the broader market might base their purchasing decisions on less logical reasoning. My main confusion with the downvotes stemmed from the fact that while my comment may not have had much to do with the original topic, I thought it was appropriately related to the post I was responding to, and said post arguably had as little to do with the original topic as mine, while not garnering similar downvotes. In any case, thanks again for the explanation. I'll try and do a better job of staying on topic and crafting my responses.
deleted 10y ago
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paulcole 10y ago
Millions of people buy Apple products because of the status they convey. Those are the people Apple cares about serving. If their "hardware is solid" as well then that's just a happy byproduct. Are you really saying that status symbol is not a MASSIVE part of Apple's marketing strategy?
- eridius 10y ago
  No, you just like to think that millions of people buy it because of status, because it lets you feel superior to them. Apple's marketing is a mixture of reinforcing the brand (just like any big company), enticing people to upgrade to the latest model (e.g. the big iPhone image on apple.com right now, which isn't going to convince any Android user to switch but is instead aimed at existing iPhone users), and showing off the great cameras on the iPhone (e.g. the whole "Shot on iPhone" series of ads) because that's a big-ticket item that might convince people to switch/upgrade and it's a major competitive advantage Apple has over other manufactures.
- nicky0 10y ago
  What exactly about Apple's marketing would you say is "status symbol" based? I mainly see ads with a focus on the products themselves.
  - walshemj 10y ago
    the $14k iwatch
    - nicky0 10y ago
      Yeah, there is that.. But look at an Apple classic ads like the "There's an app for that" series. Nothing really aspirational or status-reaching about those ads.
      - Infinitesimus 10y ago
        I'd say the "I'm a mac, I'm a PC" ads did a great job conveying a certain kind of image of the "mac user" vs the boring office guy that was the pc user. At least that's the vibe it gave me when I first watched them Of course it is silly to assume most of Apple's sales come from people looking for the wow factor and ignore the Apple appealed to geek hearts as well early on. Anecdotally, I still think a significant number of people outside the highly selective HN crowd view Apple as a status symbol or a go-to. Doesn't mean apple doesn't make subjectively great products though
TurboHaskal 10y ago
But you browse HN and are most probably a software professional. You're definitely not the average consumer. Me personally, I ask for Macbooks because they mostly don't offer shitty products as their entry models. And even though I'm a fan of business laptops such as Thinkpad and Latitude, every single time I asked for one management starts to cheap out with terrible TN screens, minimum RAM and spinning drives.
- 72deluxe 10y ago
  Darn right about the screens. And your parent is right about flexy keyboards. I chose the MacBook due to the OS at the time (Snow Leopard where art thou) and hardware, although it'll be some time before anyone can wrest the 2012 MBPr from me due to it actually having ports on it
walshemj 10y ago
But mac keyboards are horrid for touch typists
- 72deluxe 10y ago
  Which ones? I have a wired one with number pad (yes, it's chiclet) and it is shallow, plus I use my MacBook Pro 2012 non-retina too (which is chiclet, but not as shallow as the Air keyboards) and I can touch type on both no problem at all. So which keyboard prevents touch typing?
  - walshemj 10y ago
    All the new ones from experience at work - nasty nasty feel
- JustSomeNobody 10y ago
  I don't find that to be the case at all.

Inconel 10y ago

You may not have bought a Mac to be like everyone else but that doesn't necessarily mean that many others aren't buying Apple products at least partially due to brand status and social signaling. Edit: I don't mind the downvotes if I have said something stupid but could I get some clarification here? I'm typing this on a MacBook so I clearly like Apple products but it seems like branding and marketing are fairly important to Apple, otherwise they probably wouldn't spend billions of dollars on ad campaigns.

striking 10y ago
In my view (though I did not downvote you) I felt you brought little to a conversation about tools for professionals. Sure, Apple doesn't make good pro tools anymore, but the interesting part is the anymore. It used to be that they made incredible workstations with really interesting gear, capturing a sort of "pro consumer" market. Maybe your point was that the financials are no longer there to support pro gear or creativity or even OS X as a whole because phones make them more money. If it was, though, you didn't express it. And I agree with the fact that many people are buying them because they're simply status symbols, but many more people buy them because they see it as the easiest choice. Your (average, run-of-the-mill) grandma's not going to be able to choose one of many Android phones unless her grandson tells her which one to pick. At that point she might just walk into an Apple store and out with a new phone. If that was part of your point, you also didn't express that. So I think you're losing points because your points aren't all too accurate or visible (at least from my point of view) and because, even if they were, they have very little to do about the deprecation of Apple's tooling for semi-/pro users.
- Inconel 10y ago
  Thanks for the detailed response, I very much appreciate it. Looking back, I suppose you are correct that my comment didn't add much to the conversation. In my defense though, my comment was a response to another poster who seemed to imply that no one buys Apple products due to it being a status symbol, at least that's how I interpret the line "Just stop with the status symbol crap". Said poster then uses their own reason for purchasing a Mac to completely dismiss the possibility that the broader market might base their purchasing decisions on less logical reasoning. My main confusion with the downvotes stemmed from the fact that while my comment may not have had much to do with the original topic, I thought it was appropriately related to the post I was responding to, and said post arguably had as little to do with the original topic as mine, while not garnering similar downvotes. In any case, thanks again for the explanation. I'll try and do a better job of staying on topic and crafting my responses.

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

paulcole 10y ago

Millions of people buy Apple products because of the status they convey. Those are the people Apple cares about serving. If their "hardware is solid" as well then that's just a happy byproduct. Are you really saying that status symbol is not a MASSIVE part of Apple's marketing strategy?

eridius 10y ago
No, you just like to think that millions of people buy it because of status, because it lets you feel superior to them. Apple's marketing is a mixture of reinforcing the brand (just like any big company), enticing people to upgrade to the latest model (e.g. the big iPhone image on apple.com right now, which isn't going to convince any Android user to switch but is instead aimed at existing iPhone users), and showing off the great cameras on the iPhone (e.g. the whole "Shot on iPhone" series of ads) because that's a big-ticket item that might convince people to switch/upgrade and it's a major competitive advantage Apple has over other manufactures.
nicky0 10y ago
What exactly about Apple's marketing would you say is "status symbol" based? I mainly see ads with a focus on the products themselves.
- walshemj 10y ago
  the $14k iwatch
  - nicky0 10y ago
    Yeah, there is that.. But look at an Apple classic ads like the "There's an app for that" series. Nothing really aspirational or status-reaching about those ads.
    - Infinitesimus 10y ago
      I'd say the "I'm a mac, I'm a PC" ads did a great job conveying a certain kind of image of the "mac user" vs the boring office guy that was the pc user. At least that's the vibe it gave me when I first watched them Of course it is silly to assume most of Apple's sales come from people looking for the wow factor and ignore the Apple appealed to geek hearts as well early on. Anecdotally, I still think a significant number of people outside the highly selective HN crowd view Apple as a status symbol or a go-to. Doesn't mean apple doesn't make subjectively great products though

TurboHaskal 10y ago

But you browse HN and are most probably a software professional. You're definitely not the average consumer. Me personally, I ask for Macbooks because they mostly don't offer shitty products as their entry models. And even though I'm a fan of business laptops such as Thinkpad and Latitude, every single time I asked for one management starts to cheap out with terrible TN screens, minimum RAM and spinning drives.

72deluxe 10y ago
Darn right about the screens. And your parent is right about flexy keyboards. I chose the MacBook due to the OS at the time (Snow Leopard where art thou) and hardware, although it'll be some time before anyone can wrest the 2012 MBPr from me due to it actually having ports on it

walshemj 10y ago

But mac keyboards are horrid for touch typists

72deluxe 10y ago
Which ones? I have a wired one with number pad (yes, it's chiclet) and it is shallow, plus I use my MacBook Pro 2012 non-retina too (which is chiclet, but not as shallow as the Air keyboards) and I can touch type on both no problem at all. So which keyboard prevents touch typing?
- walshemj 10y ago
  All the new ones from experience at work - nasty nasty feel
JustSomeNobody 10y ago
I don't find that to be the case at all.