5 ms·

Oh, totally. If interviews were a perfect science, and perfectly measured ability, then you wouldn't need to prepare for them at all. You're absolutely right th

Oh, totally. If interviews were a perfect science, and perfectly measured ability, then you wouldn't need to prepare for them at all. You're absolutely right there. And if it were 100% about preparation -- if preparation could land anyone any job they wanted -- then the interviews would be mostly worthless (other than perhaps assessing how much work someone is willing to put in). The reality is somewhere in between: Preparation helps someone perform at their best, but it will not land anyone any job they want. This is why tech companies actually encourage preparation -- it reduces the number of good candidates who get rejected. Note that this isn't really unique to coding interviews. People prepare for ALL types of interviews, so it's revealing the same flaw in all of them.

jakebasile 10y ago
In my experience over the past year, programmer interviews are almost all the way towards the "preparation" (learning to interview, not learning to do the job) end of the scale, with a unhealthy doses of sadism and elitism. I've rarely been asked anything that has something meaningful to do with my abilities as an engineer, only demeaning HackerRank style tests that check only for algorithmic academics knowledge, insulting take-home exams that ignore existing code and industry experience, and torturous whiteboard sessions that select for nothing except ability to withstand day-long in-person inquisitions. HackerRank is a symptom of the terrible interview cult that is pervasive in our industry which is so extremely guarded against the fabled false positive hire. It is designed with absolute certainty that no one is qualified for any job unless they are some silly notion of a 10x engineer or "hacker" while claiming there is an engineering shortage. It allows us to opine about how terrible impostor syndrome is while simultaneously engendering it in others through these interview practices. It allows us to write off people with experience who are further out from college (and therefore older) or never even went under the guise of algorithmic knowledge requirements without admitting ageism. As to other industries, I have little direct experience. I know that my friends and family (none of which are in tech) have been on interviews that are humane and conversational as opposed to the inquisition our industry supports. They have all been aghast at what I've been going through.
- friendlygrammar 10y ago
  I'd guess as an alternative to the "demeaning" HackerRank style tests which are purely meritocratic and allow smaller companies to interview large amounts of people you would prefer nepotism and only hiring and interviewing people with high GPAs from expensive schools?
  - Apocryphon 10y ago
    The problem with meritocracy by standardized testing is eventually you reach Eastern/Southern Asian extremes with cram school culture of people endlessly drilling for tests. It's possible to rotely memorize strategies for applying algorithms until you excel at HackerRank type tests. By then you're just interviewing for candidates who spent the most to enter the most expensive boot camps.
    - friendlygrammar 10y ago
      Which is why you A. Don't make the interviews so hard that they require multiple months of preparation. You can be prepared for the google interview by simply having taken an algorithms course and studying for 2 or 3 weeks. B. Make sure the people you hire are good communicators and are a good culture fit. C. Try to make your workforce diverse.
  - wott 10y ago
    That's a strawman if I ever saw one. He never said anything like this.
    - friendlygrammar 10y ago
      He didn't provide any alternative and what I described is the status quo for companies outside of software engineering.
  - cult4you 10y ago
    I think the high tech industry has always been ran and controlled by sick people. That' why its not considered a proession like med, law, or finance. When I was younger I worked at DEC for a while, about the time the VAX came out, it was hot. We had a HR manager who required all new hires to strip in a private room, and then if the HR liked what he saw the newbie would get passed on to engineering. I thought this odd, and the HR manager was openly gay, and a sleaze to boot. The simple fact that people of power in our industry can be sadists, and not anybody is willing to step forward hasn't changed one iota since 1970's.

jakebasile 10y ago

In my experience over the past year, programmer interviews are almost all the way towards the "preparation" (learning to interview, not learning to do the job) end of the scale, with a unhealthy doses of sadism and elitism. I've rarely been asked anything that has something meaningful to do with my abilities as an engineer, only demeaning HackerRank style tests that check only for algorithmic academics knowledge, insulting take-home exams that ignore existing code and industry experience, and torturous whiteboard sessions that select for nothing except ability to withstand day-long in-person inquisitions. HackerRank is a symptom of the terrible interview cult that is pervasive in our industry which is so extremely guarded against the fabled false positive hire. It is designed with absolute certainty that no one is qualified for any job unless they are some silly notion of a 10x engineer or "hacker" while claiming there is an engineering shortage. It allows us to opine about how terrible impostor syndrome is while simultaneously engendering it in others through these interview practices. It allows us to write off people with experience who are further out from college (and therefore older) or never even went under the guise of algorithmic knowledge requirements without admitting ageism. As to other industries, I have little direct experience. I know that my friends and family (none of which are in tech) have been on interviews that are humane and conversational as opposed to the inquisition our industry supports. They have all been aghast at what I've been going through.

friendlygrammar 10y ago
I'd guess as an alternative to the "demeaning" HackerRank style tests which are purely meritocratic and allow smaller companies to interview large amounts of people you would prefer nepotism and only hiring and interviewing people with high GPAs from expensive schools?
- Apocryphon 10y ago
  The problem with meritocracy by standardized testing is eventually you reach Eastern/Southern Asian extremes with cram school culture of people endlessly drilling for tests. It's possible to rotely memorize strategies for applying algorithms until you excel at HackerRank type tests. By then you're just interviewing for candidates who spent the most to enter the most expensive boot camps.
  - friendlygrammar 10y ago
    Which is why you A. Don't make the interviews so hard that they require multiple months of preparation. You can be prepared for the google interview by simply having taken an algorithms course and studying for 2 or 3 weeks. B. Make sure the people you hire are good communicators and are a good culture fit. C. Try to make your workforce diverse.
- wott 10y ago
  That's a strawman if I ever saw one. He never said anything like this.
  - friendlygrammar 10y ago
    He didn't provide any alternative and what I described is the status quo for companies outside of software engineering.
- cult4you 10y ago
  I think the high tech industry has always been ran and controlled by sick people. That' why its not considered a proession like med, law, or finance. When I was younger I worked at DEC for a while, about the time the VAX came out, it was hot. We had a HR manager who required all new hires to strip in a private room, and then if the HR liked what he saw the newbie would get passed on to engineering. I thought this odd, and the HR manager was openly gay, and a sleaze to boot. The simple fact that people of power in our industry can be sadists, and not anybody is willing to step forward hasn't changed one iota since 1970's.