8 ms·

>However, this is a very favorable interpretation of the data. Incomes are going up, but so are prices The data doesn't agree with you. http://www.tradingecon

>However, this is a very favorable interpretation of the data. Incomes are going up, but so are prices The data doesn't agree with you. http://www.tradingeconomics.com/united-states/consumer-price-index-cpi http://www.tradingeconomics.com/united-states/consumer-price... (make sure to click for the 5 year chart to see how little prices have changed) If you are basing your info off of living in Silicon Valley, Silicon Valley isn't reality. http://www.economist.com/blogs/graphicdetail/2016/08/daily-chart-20 http://www.economist.com/blogs/graphicdetail/2016/08/daily-c... Silicon Valley prices are inflated because of artificial supply constraints. When housing is so expensive that unskilled labor can't even afford to live 90 minutes from the city, wages will rise until they can move a reasonable distance from the city and thus prices will rise to accommodate the wage increase.

rm2889 10y ago
Here's some counter narrative to this article based on data out of gallup http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-09-20/we-havent-seen-great-depression-gallup-ceo-destroys-recovery-lie http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-09-20/we-havent-seen-grea...
- friendlygrammar 10y ago
  We have just started hitting goals for inflation and job growth so it makes perfect sense that a poll from 2015 will indicate that the public is discouraged. edit: look at the CPI chart I posted and you will notice the period of deflation in 2015. Deflation is bad.
- blahi 10y ago
  And here are some facts that speak about zerohedge's credibility. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-04-29/unmasking-the-men-behind-zero-hedge-wall-street-s-renegade-blog http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-04-29/unmasking-...
  - rm2889 10y ago
    Zerohedge merely copy-pasted the original article from gallup http://www.gallup.com/opinion/chairman/195680/invisible-american.aspx http://www.gallup.com/opinion/chairman/195680/invisible-amer...
  - cloudjacker 10y ago
    how to avoid the "zerohedge rebuttal", for future reference 1. go to zerohedge article that raised awareness in the most sensational and comical way since Lehman 2. look for the sources in the zerohedge article 3. quote the source instead
downandout 10y ago
Incomes of those that have managed to get a job are rising because of state-mandated increases in minimum wage - not because of natural market forces. Businesses have two ways to compensate for the higher cost of labor that has been imposed on them: they can hire fewer people, and they can raise prices. Some will do both. But prices will rise - they just haven't yet because most of the increases in minimum wage were fairly recent.
- jessriedel 10y ago
  You've edited your top-level comment from "Incomes are going up, but so are prices" to "Incomes are going up in large part due to increases in the minimum wage, which will ultimately cause a rise in prices" in response to friendlygrammar's data. Why didn't you mark the edit, which substantially changes your claims?
  - unclebucknasty 10y ago
    Testament to the current political reality: ideology trumps facts. It's an old saying that democracy depends upon an informed citizenry, but what happens when the citizenry doesn't act in accordance with the information?
- hackuser 10y ago
  Do you have any basis for this claim?
  - threeseed 10y ago
    There is none. It's been "wisdom" for so many years that low taxes and low minimum wage results in increased employment and better prosperity for all. Guess what. It hasn't worked. And it's a stupid argument to make when productivity is such an important measure that never gets factored in. How productive are workers who can't afford to properly live ?
- unclebucknasty 10y ago
  >prices will rise While the overall impact of minimum wage increases on prices is far from settled, history has not shown it to lead to the catastrohic increases that are oft-foretold by opponents. For instance, one full year after Washington's wage increase, we aren't seeing marked price increases [0]. If the effects of the wage increase on businesses was as profound as the doom-sayers wanted us to believe, then a year is certainly more than enough time to have seen them. >they can hire fewer people An expanding economy (which is partially fueled by higher incomes), helps to offset displacement of workers. Further, it's not as if businesses were seeking to hire workers they didn't need in any case. In fact, the ever-striving for optimal efficiency and productivity combined with automation is largely to blame for the lower labor demand/stagnant wages that precipitated the need for an increased minimum wage in the first place. [0] http://www.washington.edu/news/2016/04/18/early-analysis-of-seattles-15-wage-law-effect-on-prices-minimal-one-year-after-implementation/ http://www.washington.edu/news/2016/04/18/early-analysis-of-...
makomk 10y ago
The article argues that people are leaving poverty by moving to places with higher minimum wages and through places with large populations increasing their minimum wage. Which means expensive-to-live-in places like San Francisco, DC, New York etc because those are the places with the higher minimum wage. It also means that the places they're moving to will become more expensive because of more demand for housing.

rm2889 10y ago

Here's some counter narrative to this article based on data out of gallup http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-09-20/we-havent-seen-great-depression-gallup-ceo-destroys-recovery-lie http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-09-20/we-havent-seen-grea...

friendlygrammar 10y ago
We have just started hitting goals for inflation and job growth so it makes perfect sense that a poll from 2015 will indicate that the public is discouraged. edit: look at the CPI chart I posted and you will notice the period of deflation in 2015. Deflation is bad.
blahi 10y ago
And here are some facts that speak about zerohedge's credibility. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-04-29/unmasking-the-men-behind-zero-hedge-wall-street-s-renegade-blog http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-04-29/unmasking-...
- rm2889 10y ago
  Zerohedge merely copy-pasted the original article from gallup http://www.gallup.com/opinion/chairman/195680/invisible-american.aspx http://www.gallup.com/opinion/chairman/195680/invisible-amer...
- cloudjacker 10y ago
  how to avoid the "zerohedge rebuttal", for future reference 1. go to zerohedge article that raised awareness in the most sensational and comical way since Lehman 2. look for the sources in the zerohedge article 3. quote the source instead

downandout 10y ago

Incomes of those that have managed to get a job are rising because of state-mandated increases in minimum wage - not because of natural market forces. Businesses have two ways to compensate for the higher cost of labor that has been imposed on them: they can hire fewer people, and they can raise prices. Some will do both. But prices will rise - they just haven't yet because most of the increases in minimum wage were fairly recent.

jessriedel 10y ago
You've edited your top-level comment from "Incomes are going up, but so are prices" to "Incomes are going up in large part due to increases in the minimum wage, which will ultimately cause a rise in prices" in response to friendlygrammar's data. Why didn't you mark the edit, which substantially changes your claims?
- unclebucknasty 10y ago
  Testament to the current political reality: ideology trumps facts. It's an old saying that democracy depends upon an informed citizenry, but what happens when the citizenry doesn't act in accordance with the information?
hackuser 10y ago
Do you have any basis for this claim?
- threeseed 10y ago
  There is none. It's been "wisdom" for so many years that low taxes and low minimum wage results in increased employment and better prosperity for all. Guess what. It hasn't worked. And it's a stupid argument to make when productivity is such an important measure that never gets factored in. How productive are workers who can't afford to properly live ?
unclebucknasty 10y ago
>prices will rise While the overall impact of minimum wage increases on prices is far from settled, history has not shown it to lead to the catastrohic increases that are oft-foretold by opponents. For instance, one full year after Washington's wage increase, we aren't seeing marked price increases [0]. If the effects of the wage increase on businesses was as profound as the doom-sayers wanted us to believe, then a year is certainly more than enough time to have seen them. >they can hire fewer people An expanding economy (which is partially fueled by higher incomes), helps to offset displacement of workers. Further, it's not as if businesses were seeking to hire workers they didn't need in any case. In fact, the ever-striving for optimal efficiency and productivity combined with automation is largely to blame for the lower labor demand/stagnant wages that precipitated the need for an increased minimum wage in the first place. [0] http://www.washington.edu/news/2016/04/18/early-analysis-of-seattles-15-wage-law-effect-on-prices-minimal-one-year-after-implementation/ http://www.washington.edu/news/2016/04/18/early-analysis-of-...

makomk 10y ago

The article argues that people are leaving poverty by moving to places with higher minimum wages and through places with large populations increasing their minimum wage. Which means expensive-to-live-in places like San Francisco, DC, New York etc because those are the places with the higher minimum wage. It also means that the places they're moving to will become more expensive because of more demand for housing.