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You seem to think these traits are fixed. They are not. I'm currently reading "The Pursuit of Perfect" by Tal Ben-Shahar, give this one a go, it'll free you of

by AJJB10 10y ago

You seem to think these traits are fixed. They are not. I'm currently reading "The Pursuit of Perfect" by Tal Ben-Shahar, give this one a go, it'll free you of your blame, shame and beliefs. This extrovert/introvert label is used in ways it shouldn't. Two kinds of people hide behind being an introvert: assholes and people afraid of other people, often a mixture of both. Both groups alienate people with their behaviors and thus are lonely, sometimes angry about it, which worsens both traits. They don't want to be, making contact with people exhausting. Instead of addressing the real problem, they get isolated even more or, like you, externalize getting happiness, which I bet Heroin is very good at consistently delivering. Again: these traits are not fixed. If you think of yourself as unlikable, you will be. If you think people are all stupid (way to generalize), you will alienate other people. If you think other people are dangerous, which you might have had to learn early in your life, you will behave in a way that other people don't find pleasurable and won't choose to be around you. It's painful to think about, so people just say they're introverted. You can accept that & change, or you can stay where you are. I myself decided to stay in this social coma for 20 years, really angry about it too, being even harder on myself & others. Didn't help. Now people (voluntarily!) call me.

mercer 10y ago
> This extrovert/introvert label is used in ways it shouldn't. Two kinds of people hide behind being an introvert: assholes and people afraid of other people, often a mixture of both That leaves out the sizable kind of people who actually are introverts. It strikes me as rather dangerous to take what seems to be a pretty simple observation - people occupy a spectrum from 'enjoying little to no social contact' to 'does not enjoy being alone at all' and we call this introversion/extraversion - and basically arguing that one of the end of the spectrum is 'wrong' and can be fixed. Not to mention the fact that most actual research on the matter seems to indicate that introversion is, at least to some significant degree, innate, and at the very least can be distinguished at such an early age that it might as well be innate. Honestly, it's not so different in my mind from believing gay people are gay because <insert some self-serving theory> instead of accepting that in lieu of full understand, we should maybe just assume they are actually gay. Or Christians insisting that non-believers are in denial and even actively rejecting 'the Truth', actively unhappy, and that they have gaping God-shaped hole inside of them. Or, for that matter, Christians insisting that other Christians are not happy or doing well because they don't have enough faith, are not trying hard enough, or because 'there must be some kind of sin in their life'. The danger of such statements is that they have massive impact on the group your judging, and that they ultimately can never be fully refuted. What makes it worse is that, in my experience, most 'outliers' - whether gay, autistic, clinically depressed, etc. - already live with a permanent suspicion that they're just not trying hard enough and making excuses. EDIT: to be clear, I do agree that any of these labels can be used as an excuse, and nothing is 100% fixed. So in context you might be right. I just feel it's important to note that there are many people who are truly introverted, and they should not feel bad or wrong about that.
- AJJB10 10y ago
  You're right. I think actual introverts wouldn't feel so negative about it.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
snovv_crash 10y ago
>Two kinds of people hide behind being an introvert: assholes and people afraid of other people, often a mixture of both. False dichotomy. I love hanging out with people, and get on with a lot of people really well, but I need alone time in between or it becomes a hellish experience. Kind of like how I love being awake, but if I don't sleep regularly then being awake is really horrible. Then again, extroverts who don't understand this probably think I'm an aloof asshole for not wanting to socialise with strangers all the time.
- AJJB10 10y ago
  Then you're an actual introvert! Nothing wrong with that! I should have been clearer: There are introverts and then the aforementioned two kinds of people hiding behind the label.

by AJJB10 10y ago

mercer 10y ago

> This extrovert/introvert label is used in ways it shouldn't. Two kinds of people hide behind being an introvert: assholes and people afraid of other people, often a mixture of both That leaves out the sizable kind of people who actually are introverts. It strikes me as rather dangerous to take what seems to be a pretty simple observation - people occupy a spectrum from 'enjoying little to no social contact' to 'does not enjoy being alone at all' and we call this introversion/extraversion - and basically arguing that one of the end of the spectrum is 'wrong' and can be fixed. Not to mention the fact that most actual research on the matter seems to indicate that introversion is, at least to some significant degree, innate, and at the very least can be distinguished at such an early age that it might as well be innate. Honestly, it's not so different in my mind from believing gay people are gay because <insert some self-serving theory> instead of accepting that in lieu of full understand, we should maybe just assume they are actually gay. Or Christians insisting that non-believers are in denial and even actively rejecting 'the Truth', actively unhappy, and that they have gaping God-shaped hole inside of them. Or, for that matter, Christians insisting that other Christians are not happy or doing well because they don't have enough faith, are not trying hard enough, or because 'there must be some kind of sin in their life'. The danger of such statements is that they have massive impact on the group your judging, and that they ultimately can never be fully refuted. What makes it worse is that, in my experience, most 'outliers' - whether gay, autistic, clinically depressed, etc. - already live with a permanent suspicion that they're just not trying hard enough and making excuses. EDIT: to be clear, I do agree that any of these labels can be used as an excuse, and nothing is 100% fixed. So in context you might be right. I just feel it's important to note that there are many people who are truly introverted, and they should not feel bad or wrong about that.

AJJB10 10y ago
You're right. I think actual introverts wouldn't feel so negative about it.

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

snovv_crash 10y ago

>Two kinds of people hide behind being an introvert: assholes and people afraid of other people, often a mixture of both. False dichotomy. I love hanging out with people, and get on with a lot of people really well, but I need alone time in between or it becomes a hellish experience. Kind of like how I love being awake, but if I don't sleep regularly then being awake is really horrible. Then again, extroverts who don't understand this probably think I'm an aloof asshole for not wanting to socialise with strangers all the time.

AJJB10 10y ago
Then you're an actual introvert! Nothing wrong with that! I should have been clearer: There are introverts and then the aforementioned two kinds of people hiding behind the label.