> So many game designers (especially amateur ones) seem to think game design is about screwing over the player at every opportunity Yes. For me, those style ga

> So many game designers (especially amateur ones) seem to think game design is about screwing over the player at every opportunity Yes. For me, those style games are the most fun, but only when well executed. Dwarf Fortress and "losing is fun!" is my favorite example. I like it when games give you all the tools, then lull you into forgetting about them. Not so much an obscure reference early on, but more like the original Zelda. Zelda forced you to really explore the whole map. You could skip something, but then you'd miss the raft and couldn't get to level 6 (maybe 7). Anyway, there's a punishing annoying way to do it, and there's an "aha! that's how that works!" kind of way to do it. I prefer the latter.