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I don't think this is intentional by Google, but think the problem comes down to the fact that they keep antagonizing the content creator community that they cl

I don't think this is intentional by Google, but think the problem comes down to the fact that they keep antagonizing the content creator community that they claim they want to help. The YouTube Heroes program antagonized the content creator community by: 1. By trying to get free labor to clean up the comments system instead of doing it themselves. 2. Creating new concerns about who is going to watch the watchers. 3. Showing new management features for Heroes that content creators themselves have been asking for and still can't get. This secret video edit is another slap in the face because: 1. It potentially undermines public responses they've already posted based on the original video and new people (and trolls) may call them out their complaints that no longer match up with what is said. 2. It shows yet another feature YouTube content creators have been asking for, but can't use themselves. I don't think Google is intentionally trying to tick off their own community, but it is amazing how dense they are. And for content creators, this is just another instance of Google not listening to them.

shostack 10y ago
Presumably Google hires smart product people. So how do you imagine the conversation and decision making process went assuming they were aware of this dynamic?
- forgettableuser 10y ago
  It seems like they live in an echo chamber sometimes or they are more fixated on solving their own problems instead of their users. Google more than any other company seems to have a bias in that if a problem can't be solved by an algorithm and brute force human labor is required, they just don't want to do it and will find every excuse to avoid it. In this case, it really feels like they "have this great idea to clean up the comments" problem that "doesn't require Google to do any work". It feels like they were willing to buy into the hype around Gamification of everything to solve their all problems to justify an internal aversion to solving problems the hard way, which would require Google to pay for actual human labor. It was "win-win" in their echo chamber because it doesn't cost them much in terms of effort or money, while content creators should be happy Google is trying to improve the situation. Another good example is the case of Eli the Computer Guy. He is an interesting content creator because he has actual marketable skills outside content creation and has built his own businesses before. He was a focal point last year during another YouTube controversy which later became known as #WTFU. After getting screwed by "The Algorithm", he announced he was leaving YouTube because the environment was not conducive to building a serious business around. One of the stories he told was he used to have a Google Content Partner, an actual human he could talk to if he had problems. Then shortly after, that person announced she got a promotion and was leaving with no replacement. "But don't worry, we have a great solution for you. You can use our forums if you have questions." Eli has gone on about how dense they were that they didn't understand that this was a terrible thing and forums were no replacement for an actual person. It was one of many examples he cited about how out of touch Google is with their own community. Eventually, after this controversy, they managed to keep Eli on YouTube for now, doing the "bare minimum" to keep him, which includes giving him a person to talk to. But there are much bigger YouTube creators who still don't have anybody they can talk to.
- pmontra 10y ago
  Maybe they are smart along some dimensions but less along others. In general Google seems to be good at dealing with algorithms but not as good as other companies at dealing with people. It could be a conscious decision or an unfortunate consequence that their first product has been an algorithm that happened to delight people.

shostack 10y ago

Presumably Google hires smart product people. So how do you imagine the conversation and decision making process went assuming they were aware of this dynamic?

forgettableuser 10y ago
It seems like they live in an echo chamber sometimes or they are more fixated on solving their own problems instead of their users. Google more than any other company seems to have a bias in that if a problem can't be solved by an algorithm and brute force human labor is required, they just don't want to do it and will find every excuse to avoid it. In this case, it really feels like they "have this great idea to clean up the comments" problem that "doesn't require Google to do any work". It feels like they were willing to buy into the hype around Gamification of everything to solve their all problems to justify an internal aversion to solving problems the hard way, which would require Google to pay for actual human labor. It was "win-win" in their echo chamber because it doesn't cost them much in terms of effort or money, while content creators should be happy Google is trying to improve the situation. Another good example is the case of Eli the Computer Guy. He is an interesting content creator because he has actual marketable skills outside content creation and has built his own businesses before. He was a focal point last year during another YouTube controversy which later became known as #WTFU. After getting screwed by "The Algorithm", he announced he was leaving YouTube because the environment was not conducive to building a serious business around. One of the stories he told was he used to have a Google Content Partner, an actual human he could talk to if he had problems. Then shortly after, that person announced she got a promotion and was leaving with no replacement. "But don't worry, we have a great solution for you. You can use our forums if you have questions." Eli has gone on about how dense they were that they didn't understand that this was a terrible thing and forums were no replacement for an actual person. It was one of many examples he cited about how out of touch Google is with their own community. Eventually, after this controversy, they managed to keep Eli on YouTube for now, doing the "bare minimum" to keep him, which includes giving him a person to talk to. But there are much bigger YouTube creators who still don't have anybody they can talk to.
pmontra 10y ago
Maybe they are smart along some dimensions but less along others. In general Google seems to be good at dealing with algorithms but not as good as other companies at dealing with people. It could be a conscious decision or an unfortunate consequence that their first product has been an algorithm that happened to delight people.