4 ms·

I guess I should clarify. Economic integration. If you read the article a lot of mainland capital is flowing into Hong Kong. That being said I do think the poli

I guess I should clarify. Economic integration. If you read the article a lot of mainland capital is flowing into Hong Kong. That being said I do think the political and cultural aspects are troubling.

ZenoArrow 10y ago
Did Hong Kong need that influx of capital though? I've never lived there but from what I've seen it doesn't seem to be a place that has struggled economically in the past few decades.
spacehunt 10y ago
Mainland Chinese capital is flowing into other countries as well, without the need for "integration" -- in economic terms, that would mean things like the relaxation of security listing rules (which are happening).
sirspudd 10y ago
Yes, by people with money who don't want to live in the mainland. Incase you haven't realized it, people with money get out of China. Taiwan and Hong Kong are functional entities with a lifestyle (and civil liberties) which are wholly familiar to anyone who has lived in a civil democracy. The individual is worth something. Go visit the Bodies exhibit if you want to meet a mainland Democrat/political dissident. Please also note that big chunk of the population in both Hong Kong and Taiwan fled the Cultural Revolution; so Chinese reintegration would best be compared to the state of Israel being given back to a direct descendant of the Nazi party. #Godwin #EverythingIsAwesome
x2398dh1 10y ago
I would posit that the article's assertion of capital flowing into Hong Kong is deeply flawed, and the article was possibly paid for by people from China or the US who have an interest in this happening (although I have very little basis for asserting that possibility). The foundation for currency is trust. Hong Kong has a functioning legal system, whereas China does not and will not in the future - by eroding that autonomy, China is in effect canibalizing its own capital base. If you have room mate A and room mate B, and room mate A is very trustworthy while B is not, but B starts writing down tons of IOUs for millions of dollars onto pieces of paper and gives them to roommate A, is roommate A now richer? Well it depends upon roommate B's ability to pay back. Now, if roommate B has a business selling widgets, but no organizational skills to keep all of the contracts in order, and outsources that to roommate A, then the system works. If roommate B interfere's with A's ability to organize by...I don't know...getting A drunk on a regular basis so he can't complete his job, then the enterprise as a whole collapses. That's what is going to happen in China with what they are going to do with Hong Kong, with China obviously being B and Hong Kong being A.
- Canada 10y ago
  Nobody is thinking this way. Chinese people with money aren't particularly distrustful of their government, they're just trying to buy what they want before someone else does. An enormous number of Chinese people have made huge amounts of money. They've already bid up all the desirable areas in their own country to insane prices. It's San Francisco bad. So they look elsewhere. They see lots of opportunities in the West that offer more value for their money, an opportunity to escape from the brutal rat race that China is, and a mature legal system and deep cultural respect for property rights. All they have to do is make payment... They can't just wire the money out because the Chinese government imposes strict capital controls. So they bypass them through HK, insurance schemes, investment schemes, through purchase and return of expensive luxury items, by having friends and family wire out of their accounts to their limits, with bitcoin, with good old bags of cash through the airport, or whatever other creative solutions they can find.

ZenoArrow 10y ago

Did Hong Kong need that influx of capital though? I've never lived there but from what I've seen it doesn't seem to be a place that has struggled economically in the past few decades.

spacehunt 10y ago

Mainland Chinese capital is flowing into other countries as well, without the need for "integration" -- in economic terms, that would mean things like the relaxation of security listing rules (which are happening).

sirspudd 10y ago

Yes, by people with money who don't want to live in the mainland. Incase you haven't realized it, people with money get out of China. Taiwan and Hong Kong are functional entities with a lifestyle (and civil liberties) which are wholly familiar to anyone who has lived in a civil democracy. The individual is worth something. Go visit the Bodies exhibit if you want to meet a mainland Democrat/political dissident. Please also note that big chunk of the population in both Hong Kong and Taiwan fled the Cultural Revolution; so Chinese reintegration would best be compared to the state of Israel being given back to a direct descendant of the Nazi party. #Godwin #EverythingIsAwesome

x2398dh1 10y ago

I would posit that the article's assertion of capital flowing into Hong Kong is deeply flawed, and the article was possibly paid for by people from China or the US who have an interest in this happening (although I have very little basis for asserting that possibility). The foundation for currency is trust. Hong Kong has a functioning legal system, whereas China does not and will not in the future - by eroding that autonomy, China is in effect canibalizing its own capital base. If you have room mate A and room mate B, and room mate A is very trustworthy while B is not, but B starts writing down tons of IOUs for millions of dollars onto pieces of paper and gives them to roommate A, is roommate A now richer? Well it depends upon roommate B's ability to pay back. Now, if roommate B has a business selling widgets, but no organizational skills to keep all of the contracts in order, and outsources that to roommate A, then the system works. If roommate B interfere's with A's ability to organize by...I don't know...getting A drunk on a regular basis so he can't complete his job, then the enterprise as a whole collapses. That's what is going to happen in China with what they are going to do with Hong Kong, with China obviously being B and Hong Kong being A.

Canada 10y ago
Nobody is thinking this way. Chinese people with money aren't particularly distrustful of their government, they're just trying to buy what they want before someone else does. An enormous number of Chinese people have made huge amounts of money. They've already bid up all the desirable areas in their own country to insane prices. It's San Francisco bad. So they look elsewhere. They see lots of opportunities in the West that offer more value for their money, an opportunity to escape from the brutal rat race that China is, and a mature legal system and deep cultural respect for property rights. All they have to do is make payment... They can't just wire the money out because the Chinese government imposes strict capital controls. So they bypass them through HK, insurance schemes, investment schemes, through purchase and return of expensive luxury items, by having friends and family wire out of their accounts to their limits, with bitcoin, with good old bags of cash through the airport, or whatever other creative solutions they can find.