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> The Austrian company says its patented laser-welding and thermal-cooling techniques give them an edge over Tesla because the method preserves the full power o

by xgbi 10y ago

> The Austrian company says its patented laser-welding and thermal-cooling techniques give them an edge over Tesla because the method preserves the full power of the lithium-ion cells. This is what they say their advantage is against tesla. So be it, but I doubt it is revolutionnary. More importantly, Kreiser, as far as the article explains, doesn't build entire cars. They sell drivetrains and battery packages. This is completely different, Tesla has a way bigger scope.

koonsolo 10y ago
They don't have to build entire cars, because there are plenty of good car builders in Europe (which already seem to be their customers) Tesla now has an edge on the technology front, but once the traditional European brands pick up, with technology that is better than Tesla (as assumed in the article), the question is if Tesla can keep it's market position. (This is in my opinion the main idea of the article) I agree that the European brands came way too late into the game, and Tesla was clever enough to recognize this weak spot. But once Tesla starts building cheaper cars, will those who spend $70.000 on a car buy the "average" Tesla or a Mercedes, BMW or Porsche? Don't get me wrong, I really admire Tesla for how much market share they were able to get in such a short period of time. Definitely well deserved and visionary! But it's indeed a question how this market will evolve further. This Austrian company might have an impact on it.
- Swizec 10y ago
  The way auto industry has been going in recent decades, the most probable outcome is that Tesla merges with one of the main 10 vehicle manufacturing groups. Yes there are only 10 real players on the market. Toyota already owns 10% of Tesla. source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_industry#Top_vehicle_manufacturing_groups_by_volume https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_industry#Top_vehicl...
  - yabatopia 10y ago
    And yet in the article Kreisel Electric GmbH claims it’s fielding 20 inquiries a day from automotive icons including BMW and Volkswagen. I guess their phones remain silent for the four remaining days in a week.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
- nojvek 10y ago
  The biggest attraction for me in a tesla is its auto-pilot. It just keeps getting better. Google's self driving car is still not available for consumption. I doubt European car makers will even get close to Tesla in its software integration. BMW, Audi and family are not as strong a brand as Tesla is. (For me at least)
sangnoir 10y ago
> This is what they say their advantage is against tesla. So be it, but I doubt it is revolutionnary. Another advantage that is unstated in the article is that this moves the choice of electric vehicles from specific models to optional trim levels: instead of having to choose between the BMW 3 series and the i3, one could choose between the 320, 320d or the 320e
- aembleton 10y ago
  Whilst this is possible, it would be better to build an electric specific model. This is because an electric model doesn't need a fuel tank or an engine block but it will need a large number of batteries. Unilike a fuel tank these could be distributed evenly across the base of the car, lowering the centre of gravity. A 320e wouldn't have this base to store the batteries, but it could store them under the bonnet but that would make for a very poor weight distribution which would affect handling.
  - S_A_P 10y ago
    This is a key point. Tesla's main advantage so far is a purpose built electric car platform. It makes a huge difference in how things are packaged. One of the reasons for teslas great handling despite its size and heft is the low center of gravity the battery pack affords. Cramming batteries into the space previously occupied by a gas tank makes for less total capacity and depending on the location turns the car into a pendulum. Notice how most established car companies have tried this approach and end up with electric ranges of 10-80 miles. It's only just now that car makers are following teslas approach and getting above 100 miles per charge up to 2-300 miles. IMO the on time release of the model 3 will determine if tesla survives or gets acquired/fails.
    - sangnoir 10y ago
      > Notice how most established car companies have tried this approach and end up with electric ranges of 10-80 miles. To rebut this - the article has a link to a Kriesel-modified 'Scoda Yeti' that can go up to 350km/217miles[1]. So the advantages of purpose-built models don't seem to include 'range'. 1. http://www.kreiselelectric.com/en/projects/electric-yeti-4x4/ http://www.kreiselelectric.com/en/projects/electric-yeti-4x4...

by xgbi 10y ago

koonsolo 10y ago

They don't have to build entire cars, because there are plenty of good car builders in Europe (which already seem to be their customers) Tesla now has an edge on the technology front, but once the traditional European brands pick up, with technology that is better than Tesla (as assumed in the article), the question is if Tesla can keep it's market position. (This is in my opinion the main idea of the article) I agree that the European brands came way too late into the game, and Tesla was clever enough to recognize this weak spot. But once Tesla starts building cheaper cars, will those who spend $70.000 on a car buy the "average" Tesla or a Mercedes, BMW or Porsche? Don't get me wrong, I really admire Tesla for how much market share they were able to get in such a short period of time. Definitely well deserved and visionary! But it's indeed a question how this market will evolve further. This Austrian company might have an impact on it.

Swizec 10y ago
The way auto industry has been going in recent decades, the most probable outcome is that Tesla merges with one of the main 10 vehicle manufacturing groups. Yes there are only 10 real players on the market. Toyota already owns 10% of Tesla. source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_industry#Top_vehicle_manufacturing_groups_by_volume https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_industry#Top_vehicl...
- yabatopia 10y ago
  And yet in the article Kreisel Electric GmbH claims it’s fielding 20 inquiries a day from automotive icons including BMW and Volkswagen. I guess their phones remain silent for the four remaining days in a week.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
nojvek 10y ago
The biggest attraction for me in a tesla is its auto-pilot. It just keeps getting better. Google's self driving car is still not available for consumption. I doubt European car makers will even get close to Tesla in its software integration. BMW, Audi and family are not as strong a brand as Tesla is. (For me at least)

sangnoir 10y ago

> This is what they say their advantage is against tesla. So be it, but I doubt it is revolutionnary. Another advantage that is unstated in the article is that this moves the choice of electric vehicles from specific models to optional trim levels: instead of having to choose between the BMW 3 series and the i3, one could choose between the 320, 320d or the 320e

aembleton 10y ago
Whilst this is possible, it would be better to build an electric specific model. This is because an electric model doesn't need a fuel tank or an engine block but it will need a large number of batteries. Unilike a fuel tank these could be distributed evenly across the base of the car, lowering the centre of gravity. A 320e wouldn't have this base to store the batteries, but it could store them under the bonnet but that would make for a very poor weight distribution which would affect handling.
- S_A_P 10y ago
  This is a key point. Tesla's main advantage so far is a purpose built electric car platform. It makes a huge difference in how things are packaged. One of the reasons for teslas great handling despite its size and heft is the low center of gravity the battery pack affords. Cramming batteries into the space previously occupied by a gas tank makes for less total capacity and depending on the location turns the car into a pendulum. Notice how most established car companies have tried this approach and end up with electric ranges of 10-80 miles. It's only just now that car makers are following teslas approach and getting above 100 miles per charge up to 2-300 miles. IMO the on time release of the model 3 will determine if tesla survives or gets acquired/fails.
  - sangnoir 10y ago
    > Notice how most established car companies have tried this approach and end up with electric ranges of 10-80 miles. To rebut this - the article has a link to a Kriesel-modified 'Scoda Yeti' that can go up to 350km/217miles[1]. So the advantages of purpose-built models don't seem to include 'range'. 1. http://www.kreiselelectric.com/en/projects/electric-yeti-4x4/ http://www.kreiselelectric.com/en/projects/electric-yeti-4x4...