4 ms·

Until companies can walk around with guns or threaten you with imprisonment for not paying their fees or "enjoying" their products, the two are nothing alike.

Until companies can walk around with guns or threaten you with imprisonment for not paying their fees or "enjoying" their products, the two are nothing alike. Advertising doesn't use physical force.

the_af 10y ago
I don't think the "I will be a chemist" Soviet ad used physical force either.
Frondo 10y ago
Just responding to this dreary trope: if you don't pay taxes, under ordinary circumstances, you won't be imprisoned. Your paycheck will be likely garnished or some of your assets taken to cover your tax debt. For tax evasion to enter the realm of "now you're going to jail" (like Wesley Snipes) you've got to do a lot more than simply fail to write the gubmint a check.
- djschnei 10y ago
  You just proved my point... that's force and coercion. "They don't shoot you, they just steal or money!"
  - Frondo 10y ago
    Whatever tax you owe isn't your money. It's the government's money, and by refusing to pay it, you're stealing from the rest of us. That's the government enforcing our property rights when it uses force to reclaim what's ours.
    - djschnei 10y ago
      Oh, so they have claim to a percentage of my labor? without my consent? That sounds like something...
      - aperrien 10y ago
        If you don't want to consent to paying for the benefits of living in a particular society, then don't be part of that society.
        djschnei 10y ago
        "Don't like police brutality? Just move!"
      - Frondo 10y ago
        Your parents/legal guardians consented for you when you were a minor and could not make such an agreement. When you reached the age of majority, you gave consent by continuing to live here. (And if you think consent requires words, and not merely actions, try wordlessly walking out of a convenience store with a package of slim jims you didn't pay for.)
        djschnei 10y ago
        I find it endlessly amusing you're hypothetical for non-verbal consent is literally theft. However, I agree; taxation is necessary for government to exist. I'm also not an anarchist. I see taxation as a necessary evil, but I refuse to not call it what it is. Like the case with most (all) necessary evils, I consider it a moral obligation to advocate for it's conservative application. So, sorry you find it offensive that I want the government to steal less of your labor. I hold no grudges towards people that would like to see their labor partitioned towards public works to whatever extent they see fit, but I maintain coercion is immoral. Lastly, the "just move argument" is a real gem. "Don't like police brutality? just move." Talk about letting your privilege show...
        Frondo 10y ago
        Your hypothetical refusing to pay your tax is also theft; you are stealing from the rest of us. I'm glad you agree that taxation is necessary for government to exist. Some day, I hope you'll come around to doing away with silly word games like "it's theft". Because it isn't.

Until companies can walk around with guns or threaten you with imprisonment for not paying their fees or "enjoying" their products, the two are nothing alike. Advertising doesn't use physical force.

the_af 10y ago

I don't think the "I will be a chemist" Soviet ad used physical force either.

Frondo 10y ago

Just responding to this dreary trope: if you don't pay taxes, under ordinary circumstances, you won't be imprisoned. Your paycheck will be likely garnished or some of your assets taken to cover your tax debt. For tax evasion to enter the realm of "now you're going to jail" (like Wesley Snipes) you've got to do a lot more than simply fail to write the gubmint a check.

djschnei 10y ago
You just proved my point... that's force and coercion. "They don't shoot you, they just steal or money!"
- Frondo 10y ago
  Whatever tax you owe isn't your money. It's the government's money, and by refusing to pay it, you're stealing from the rest of us. That's the government enforcing our property rights when it uses force to reclaim what's ours.
  - djschnei 10y ago
    Oh, so they have claim to a percentage of my labor? without my consent? That sounds like something...
    - aperrien 10y ago
      If you don't want to consent to paying for the benefits of living in a particular society, then don't be part of that society.
      - djschnei 10y ago
        "Don't like police brutality? Just move!"
    - Frondo 10y ago
      Your parents/legal guardians consented for you when you were a minor and could not make such an agreement. When you reached the age of majority, you gave consent by continuing to live here. (And if you think consent requires words, and not merely actions, try wordlessly walking out of a convenience store with a package of slim jims you didn't pay for.)
      - djschnei 10y ago
        I find it endlessly amusing you're hypothetical for non-verbal consent is literally theft. However, I agree; taxation is necessary for government to exist. I'm also not an anarchist. I see taxation as a necessary evil, but I refuse to not call it what it is. Like the case with most (all) necessary evils, I consider it a moral obligation to advocate for it's conservative application. So, sorry you find it offensive that I want the government to steal less of your labor. I hold no grudges towards people that would like to see their labor partitioned towards public works to whatever extent they see fit, but I maintain coercion is immoral. Lastly, the "just move argument" is a real gem. "Don't like police brutality? just move." Talk about letting your privilege show...
        Frondo 10y ago
        Your hypothetical refusing to pay your tax is also theft; you are stealing from the rest of us. I'm glad you agree that taxation is necessary for government to exist. Some day, I hope you'll come around to doing away with silly word games like "it's theft". Because it isn't.