4 ms·

LOTR is a fine but flawed book. Reading it as a dark skinned Asian boy the characterization of all dark races as evil definitely stung and still hurts. The evil

LOTR is a fine but flawed book. Reading it as a dark skinned Asian boy the characterization of all dark races as evil definitely stung and still hurts. The evil side is one dimensional and has no redeeming qualities at all. The female characters also tend to be quite weak and uninteresting. Still the vision and the universe was inspiring. I still prefer it to most other fantasy.

reedlaw 10y ago
That Sauron was evil with no redeeming qualities was the whole point. Otherwise the quest would not have been so heroic. Some of the dark races were described as deceived more than evil. As far as female characters go, I would say Galadriel, Eowyn, and Arwen were all quite powerful and interesting.
- DavidWanjiru 10y ago
  >Some of the dark races were described as deceived more than evil. I would argue the larger point still stands if the light skinned races aren't depicted as falling for similar deception, because a tendency to fall for deception is equally unedifying. I haven't read the books, so I wouldn't know how other races are portrayed.
  - reedlaw 10y ago
    In Tolkien's legendarium many light-skinned races, including elves, fell for Sauron's deception.
- stinkytaco 10y ago
  Just to address these individually: 1. Plenty of heroic art has ambiguous villains, but this is certainly a modern preference. I'm sure our view of Hector in the Iliad being sympathetic is quite different than the ancient Greek's take on him. 2. The racism issue is quite real, in my opinion. This problem is somewhat exacerbated by the movies, where all the orcs have dreadlocks. But to say the dark races are "mislead" just substitutes stupidity for malice. All the heroes, without fail, are white. The elves, clearly the highest race in Tolkien's world, are white, blonde, tall and beautiful. 3. 3 women, all of whom have bit parts, at best, isn't really that great. Though they are all shown to have great redeeming qualities, two of their characters mostly revolve around their relationships with men (both of whom are in love with Aragorn, a great virtue, it seems). Galadriel is the only one who seems to have an identity and power that does not rely on her relationship to a man. Though even she appears to be secondary to Celeborn when she again appears. This is not to dismiss LotR as not good or important literature. All these criticisms could be made of the vast majority of western literature up to the late 20th Century. The Iliad has no female or low class characters at all (the Odyssey's introduction of Penelope, Eumaeus and Dido is really a watershed in western literature, and their characters are far weaker than anything in LotR), but is still studied. Because of this, I don't understand Tolkien apologism.

reedlaw 10y ago

That Sauron was evil with no redeeming qualities was the whole point. Otherwise the quest would not have been so heroic. Some of the dark races were described as deceived more than evil. As far as female characters go, I would say Galadriel, Eowyn, and Arwen were all quite powerful and interesting.

DavidWanjiru 10y ago
>Some of the dark races were described as deceived more than evil. I would argue the larger point still stands if the light skinned races aren't depicted as falling for similar deception, because a tendency to fall for deception is equally unedifying. I haven't read the books, so I wouldn't know how other races are portrayed.
- reedlaw 10y ago
  In Tolkien's legendarium many light-skinned races, including elves, fell for Sauron's deception.
stinkytaco 10y ago
Just to address these individually: 1. Plenty of heroic art has ambiguous villains, but this is certainly a modern preference. I'm sure our view of Hector in the Iliad being sympathetic is quite different than the ancient Greek's take on him. 2. The racism issue is quite real, in my opinion. This problem is somewhat exacerbated by the movies, where all the orcs have dreadlocks. But to say the dark races are "mislead" just substitutes stupidity for malice. All the heroes, without fail, are white. The elves, clearly the highest race in Tolkien's world, are white, blonde, tall and beautiful. 3. 3 women, all of whom have bit parts, at best, isn't really that great. Though they are all shown to have great redeeming qualities, two of their characters mostly revolve around their relationships with men (both of whom are in love with Aragorn, a great virtue, it seems). Galadriel is the only one who seems to have an identity and power that does not rely on her relationship to a man. Though even she appears to be secondary to Celeborn when she again appears. This is not to dismiss LotR as not good or important literature. All these criticisms could be made of the vast majority of western literature up to the late 20th Century. The Iliad has no female or low class characters at all (the Odyssey's introduction of Penelope, Eumaeus and Dido is really a watershed in western literature, and their characters are far weaker than anything in LotR), but is still studied. Because of this, I don't understand Tolkien apologism.