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> Their initial fall test actually broke some carabiners! So they adjusted it to be a smaller load. I'm surprised they didn't go by the UIAA standard of 80kg f

> Their initial fall test actually broke some carabiners! So they adjusted it to be a smaller load. I'm surprised they didn't go by the UIAA standard of 80kg factor two falls; it's been in effect for a while and makes comparisons easier. > if the long screw hits rock before going all the way in, the exposed tube creates a lever arm. In those situations the generally accepted practice is to use a webbing runner to tie off the ice screw at the ice, instead of using the hanger. This goes for pitons as well. There's a nice illustration in "Mountaineering: The Freedom of the Hills" which I can recommend picking up as a good introduction to climbing and mountaineering. The supplemental resources listed also are good if you want to go into more detail.

amaks 10y ago
I'm surprised "Mountaineering: The Freedom of the Hills" even mentions pitons as it's all about the non-destructive ethics of climbing. Honestly I don't remember it ever mentioning pitons at all but granted I read it last time few years ago.
- npsimons 10y ago
  It was more an overview, a "well, if you're going to use pitons, here's how to use them safely" at least in the case of the tie-off loop with a piton that had bottomed out.
snowwrestler 10y ago
They might have--I don't remember. I think I still have that magazine in the basement somewhere; I'll try to find it this evening.
- snowwrestler 10y ago
  Found it. Here are pictures of the magazine pages: http://imgur.com/a/uEzCF http://imgur.com/a/uEzCF
thisrod 10y ago
> I'm surprised they didn't go by the UIAA standard ... for testing dynamic ropes. That's because they weren't testing dynamic ropes. All the other UIAA standards—the ones for harnesses, nuts, camming devices, static ropes, and so on—tell you to apply a set force, usually 10kN, and see what breaks. To be pedantic, all this stuff is specified in the CE standards that the UIAA ones incorporate by reference. If you're in a lab, you apply 10kN in a precise way that uses a whopping great hydraulic ram. If you want to avoid hauling a whopping great hydraulic ram halfway up an ice cliff, then you improvise, but the aim is still to control the force acting on the gear and measure what happens. I'm using "control" and "measure" in the technical sense here. Dynamic ropes are different because they determine the forces that act on everything else. In a dynamic rope test, the conditions of a fall are controlled as well as possible, and the peak impact force it generates is one of the variables to be measured. If you did that in the ice screw tests, the results would depend on which rope you used, and that isn't what you want.

amaks 10y ago

I'm surprised "Mountaineering: The Freedom of the Hills" even mentions pitons as it's all about the non-destructive ethics of climbing. Honestly I don't remember it ever mentioning pitons at all but granted I read it last time few years ago.

npsimons 10y ago
It was more an overview, a "well, if you're going to use pitons, here's how to use them safely" at least in the case of the tie-off loop with a piton that had bottomed out.

snowwrestler 10y ago

They might have--I don't remember. I think I still have that magazine in the basement somewhere; I'll try to find it this evening.

snowwrestler 10y ago
Found it. Here are pictures of the magazine pages: http://imgur.com/a/uEzCF http://imgur.com/a/uEzCF

thisrod 10y ago

> I'm surprised they didn't go by the UIAA standard ... for testing dynamic ropes. That's because they weren't testing dynamic ropes. All the other UIAA standards—the ones for harnesses, nuts, camming devices, static ropes, and so on—tell you to apply a set force, usually 10kN, and see what breaks. To be pedantic, all this stuff is specified in the CE standards that the UIAA ones incorporate by reference. If you're in a lab, you apply 10kN in a precise way that uses a whopping great hydraulic ram. If you want to avoid hauling a whopping great hydraulic ram halfway up an ice cliff, then you improvise, but the aim is still to control the force acting on the gear and measure what happens. I'm using "control" and "measure" in the technical sense here. Dynamic ropes are different because they determine the forces that act on everything else. In a dynamic rope test, the conditions of a fall are controlled as well as possible, and the peak impact force it generates is one of the variables to be measured. If you did that in the ice screw tests, the results would depend on which rope you used, and that isn't what you want.