4 ms·

The problems are not for the individual user, but for the rest of the group. By downloading blocks in sequential order, it guarantees that the last blocks will

The problems are not for the individual user, but for the rest of the group. By downloading blocks in sequential order, it guarantees that the last blocks will be rarer on average, which is bad for collective performance.

joosters 10y ago
It doesn't have to be that bad. Users are likely to have more bandwidth available than is needed to stream the file (if they didn't, then the streaming will never work). Unlike simple HTTP streaming, the clients can use this spare bandwidth to download some blocks from the end of the file, even when streaming from near the start. So a sensible torrent streamer can still ensure that later blocks are not too rare.
- Retr0spectrum 10y ago
  I take your point. It's certainly not the end of the world, but it is sub-optimal.
  - __s 10y ago
    The increase in seeds from a more ergonomic protocol offsets the downside. Especially if the population has mostly the early blocks, but most of the population wants the early blocks, then there's room for much leech/leech sharing
rawnlq 10y ago
Guys guys hear me out ... the solution is to use "middle in" (not to be confused with middle out from Pied Piper). If you download from front and back simultaneously only the middle blocks would be scarce and you still get at least half your original streaming rate. And no weirdo will stop watching midway through a movie.
- Retr0spectrum 10y ago
  That doesn't solve the problem, it just moves it around. A reasonable compromise would be to use any "spare" bandwidth to fetch random blocks.
  - striking 10y ago
    And unfortunately, that's not what happens. Clients instead linearly download an hour's worth of content. That being said, though, do streaming clients make much of a contribution to the amount of seeded data?
BeniBoy 10y ago
While this is strictly speaking true, considering todays fast bandwidth, I don't think this is that big an issue. I am using webTorrent's desktop torrent client which has a streaming mode and usually this goes like this: download a magnet, start watching (in streaming mode), download of the file is finished within 5 minutes, and I keep seeding the full file for the rest of the duration of the movie. Usually, my ratios are bigger than with a non-streaming client torrent. Kudos to feross for his great work!

joosters 10y ago

It doesn't have to be that bad. Users are likely to have more bandwidth available than is needed to stream the file (if they didn't, then the streaming will never work). Unlike simple HTTP streaming, the clients can use this spare bandwidth to download some blocks from the end of the file, even when streaming from near the start. So a sensible torrent streamer can still ensure that later blocks are not too rare.

Retr0spectrum 10y ago
I take your point. It's certainly not the end of the world, but it is sub-optimal.
- __s 10y ago
  The increase in seeds from a more ergonomic protocol offsets the downside. Especially if the population has mostly the early blocks, but most of the population wants the early blocks, then there's room for much leech/leech sharing

rawnlq 10y ago

Guys guys hear me out ... the solution is to use "middle in" (not to be confused with middle out from Pied Piper). If you download from front and back simultaneously only the middle blocks would be scarce and you still get at least half your original streaming rate. And no weirdo will stop watching midway through a movie.

Retr0spectrum 10y ago
That doesn't solve the problem, it just moves it around. A reasonable compromise would be to use any "spare" bandwidth to fetch random blocks.
- striking 10y ago
  And unfortunately, that's not what happens. Clients instead linearly download an hour's worth of content. That being said, though, do streaming clients make much of a contribution to the amount of seeded data?

BeniBoy 10y ago

While this is strictly speaking true, considering todays fast bandwidth, I don't think this is that big an issue. I am using webTorrent's desktop torrent client which has a streaming mode and usually this goes like this: download a magnet, start watching (in streaming mode), download of the file is finished within 5 minutes, and I keep seeding the full file for the rest of the duration of the movie. Usually, my ratios are bigger than with a non-streaming client torrent. Kudos to feross for his great work!