> well a lot of them tend to join big established corporations... not to mention many successful entreprenuers don't have MBAs let alone degrees Exactly. Henc

> well a lot of them tend to join big established corporations... not to mention many successful entreprenuers don't have MBAs let alone degrees Exactly. Hence, track records are useless. Unless you have a track record of starting big successful companies. Nobody who has that would bother talking to programmers. They'd hire them to wash their ferraris for the entertainment value. >well I mentioned charisma right? Jobs and Branson are bad examples for your argument, since they are extremely charismatic - hell they're legendary for it Psst! AFTER they get rich it's called "charisma" .. until then, it's called being a loon. Take away fame and money and "charisma" suddenly = annoying personality. > better than empty words... Not really. I can build the biggest house of cards you ever saw. Not sure how that makes me money. Same thing with most applications I've seen programmers show me when they told me they're too busy to build my thing. Awesome. Profound. They even convinced me their solutions were technically superior to everyting. I can't figure out who'd give them any money for it, so in the end they amount to the same thing as my house of cards or "empty words" , ie, nothing anybody would actually buy. > what if it doesn't get built after you presold? Um, well, if programmers are still too snobby here after I got 100,000 people to pay me for it up front, (a) they're too stupid to hire because they don't realize the value of 100,000 people willing to pay you before it's even built and (b) I'd use the money to fly to Russia and spend 3 months finding programmers there. > well all the doctors I know from college have a lot of bills to pay, which don't include the extremely high cost of malpractice insurance.... =) Doctors, maybe. Surgeons, I doubt. Most surgeons can pay off med school with 1-few proceedures, depending on the nature. > extremely high cost of malpractice insurance.... =) I don't think the doctors themselves pay that - the hospitals / private companies which own/manage them these days do that.