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When you get to the point where you truly think it's a problem that someone else on the planet could potentially "stand up to you," it's time to reevaluate your

by 794CD01 10y ago

When you get to the point where you truly think it's a problem that someone else on the planet could potentially "stand up to you," it's time to reevaluate your own behavior.

umanwizard 10y ago
Why? Any country in the world would love to be in the position of security that the US occupies. Any one. Why shouldn't we do everything we can to hold on to that treasure we have?
- 794CD01 10y ago
  You should if you're an ambitious self-interested sociopath. Personally, I'm not, and I don't think my country should be, but hey, agree to disagree.
- fweespeech 10y ago
  Most of Europe doesn't act like us or behave like us and are pretty "secure" from a national security perspective. The only power that really matters is economic power and, honestly, military strength doesn't really help with that past the point you are roughly equal to everyone else.
  - CountSessine 10y ago
    Most of Europe sneers and looks down at American posturing while living happily behind the aegis of America's participation in NATO. America's profligate spending on their military has given Europe the luxury of not spending much at all on theirs and pretending that this is 'principle'. If the US withdrew from Europe and NATO, Russia would aggressively bully most of eastern Europe. Do you remember a few years ago how Russia invaded Georgia? Or how they are currently in the process of invading Ukraine? It isn't an accident that the Poland is one of the most eager participants in NATO and is the only other NATO country other than the US that is meeting their 2% GDP membership requirements.
knowaveragejoe 10y ago
To play devil's advocate, suppose we re-evaluated our own behavior and "stepped down" from that position. It would be great if nobody stepped in to fill that void, but they would without a doubt.
- 794CD01 10y ago
  That hypothetical situation is so far divorced from reality that it's impossible to say anything useful about it. Right now, the US spends more on its military than the next seven countries combined. A world in which those tables were turned would look very little like ours.
  - knowaveragejoe 10y ago
    So then why suggest it's time to "reevaluate one's own behavior"? What would that achieve?
    - 794CD01 10y ago
      Hopefully convincing people not to unnecessarily demonize those we should be collaborating with.
CountSessine 10y ago
Why? As a non-American, I would much rather have the US in that role than any other country in the world. In diplomacy and international relations the United States has conducted itself with fairness and honour, and is generally regarded outside of her borders as an honest broker. If you want to know what the world would look like without a strong, democratic, law-abiding nation as supreme military power, read up on recent news about the South China Sea and the 11-dash line. Look at the honesty and even-handedness with which America has approached border disputes with it's neighbours, and then look at what Japan, Vietnam, and the Phillipines are up against. In the world view of China's leaders, the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.
- kuschku 10y ago
  > I would much rather have the US in that role than any other country in the world You would rather see people like Trump gain the power over that, than a possible future federated Europe?
  - CountSessine 10y ago
    You would rather see people like Trump gain the power over that, than a possible future federated Europe? I would take Donald Trump or anyone currently involved in Federal US politics over Xi Xinping or Vladimir Putin. Is that what you're asking? And a federated Europe is now a given. Brexit is an existential challenge for Europe; with federation's most vocal opponent now out and with the fundamental moral hazard of endless Greek bail-outs still an issue, the EU will federate or eventually dissolve.
- 794CD01 10y ago
  In diplomacy and international relations, the US has killed countless civilians, used nuclear weapons, launched unjustified invasions of other countries, deposed democratically elected foreign leaders for opposing American interests, and to this day spies on everyone we possibly can. Maybe you're the one who should do some more reading. Or at least watch a movie. If you think the US has behaved better than other countries, that's reasonable. But that's not the same as behaving well. And a far cry from behaving well enough to be entrusted with "supreme military power".

by 794CD01 10y ago

When you get to the point where you truly think it's a problem that someone else on the planet could potentially "stand up to you," it's time to reevaluate your own behavior.

umanwizard 10y ago

Why? Any country in the world would love to be in the position of security that the US occupies. Any one. Why shouldn't we do everything we can to hold on to that treasure we have?

794CD01 10y ago
You should if you're an ambitious self-interested sociopath. Personally, I'm not, and I don't think my country should be, but hey, agree to disagree.
fweespeech 10y ago
Most of Europe doesn't act like us or behave like us and are pretty "secure" from a national security perspective. The only power that really matters is economic power and, honestly, military strength doesn't really help with that past the point you are roughly equal to everyone else.
- CountSessine 10y ago
  Most of Europe sneers and looks down at American posturing while living happily behind the aegis of America's participation in NATO. America's profligate spending on their military has given Europe the luxury of not spending much at all on theirs and pretending that this is 'principle'. If the US withdrew from Europe and NATO, Russia would aggressively bully most of eastern Europe. Do you remember a few years ago how Russia invaded Georgia? Or how they are currently in the process of invading Ukraine? It isn't an accident that the Poland is one of the most eager participants in NATO and is the only other NATO country other than the US that is meeting their 2% GDP membership requirements.

knowaveragejoe 10y ago

To play devil's advocate, suppose we re-evaluated our own behavior and "stepped down" from that position. It would be great if nobody stepped in to fill that void, but they would without a doubt.

794CD01 10y ago
That hypothetical situation is so far divorced from reality that it's impossible to say anything useful about it. Right now, the US spends more on its military than the next seven countries combined. A world in which those tables were turned would look very little like ours.
- knowaveragejoe 10y ago
  So then why suggest it's time to "reevaluate one's own behavior"? What would that achieve?
  - 794CD01 10y ago
    Hopefully convincing people not to unnecessarily demonize those we should be collaborating with.

CountSessine 10y ago

Why? As a non-American, I would much rather have the US in that role than any other country in the world. In diplomacy and international relations the United States has conducted itself with fairness and honour, and is generally regarded outside of her borders as an honest broker. If you want to know what the world would look like without a strong, democratic, law-abiding nation as supreme military power, read up on recent news about the South China Sea and the 11-dash line. Look at the honesty and even-handedness with which America has approached border disputes with it's neighbours, and then look at what Japan, Vietnam, and the Phillipines are up against. In the world view of China's leaders, the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.

kuschku 10y ago
> I would much rather have the US in that role than any other country in the world You would rather see people like Trump gain the power over that, than a possible future federated Europe?
- CountSessine 10y ago
  You would rather see people like Trump gain the power over that, than a possible future federated Europe? I would take Donald Trump or anyone currently involved in Federal US politics over Xi Xinping or Vladimir Putin. Is that what you're asking? And a federated Europe is now a given. Brexit is an existential challenge for Europe; with federation's most vocal opponent now out and with the fundamental moral hazard of endless Greek bail-outs still an issue, the EU will federate or eventually dissolve.
794CD01 10y ago
In diplomacy and international relations, the US has killed countless civilians, used nuclear weapons, launched unjustified invasions of other countries, deposed democratically elected foreign leaders for opposing American interests, and to this day spies on everyone we possibly can. Maybe you're the one who should do some more reading. Or at least watch a movie. If you think the US has behaved better than other countries, that's reasonable. But that's not the same as behaving well. And a far cry from behaving well enough to be entrusted with "supreme military power".