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Bluetooth audio is often criticized for inferior quality, but the truth is, many of the people I talk to just have experience with cheap (or older) Bluetooth au

Bluetooth audio is often criticized for inferior quality, but the truth is, many of the people I talk to just have experience with cheap (or older) Bluetooth audio devices - often with inferior hardware and poor audio codecs. I've owned some really bad Bluetooth audio devices in the past, so I can understand the criticism. Still, I believe Bluetooth audio has come a long way. I personally use a pair of Sony Bluetooth headphones almost daily (with aptX on my MBP), and I've had absolutely zero issues with pairing or sound quality for consuming content - music, video, voice, etc. Granted, I don't use them for pro audio, but when I do occasionally need the additional benefits (lossless quality, low latency) for audio recording/mixing, I use what pretty much every other pro audio person uses: an external DAC with wired studio monitor headphones or speakers. The point is, I believe most people would be happy with decent Bluetooth headphones. Those who wouldn't be happy with Bluetooth are likely to be using external audio hardware already.

Corrado 10y ago
I agree. I'm using a brand new pair of Beats (I know, I know, but they came with the MBP) and they sound really good. A little bass heavy but that is not because of the Bluetooth connection. Now, maybe a BT connection won't satisfy the most professional audiophile, but they should probably be using an optical link anyway.
20yrs_no_equity 10y ago
For me, personally, anywhere that I want to plug in my ATH-M50x is somewhere that I'm not moving, so I don't mind a dongle. USB-c provides enough wattage to power an external DAC and if Apple does get rid of the headphone port on the next MacBook Pro, then that's what I'll buy. (Currently I plug the headphones into the headphone port at work, but at home I have a DAC/Amplifier plugged into my monitor's digital audio out, thus the mac's audio goes over HDMI.) I care enough about sound quality that these headphones are the only ones I'm interested in using for awhile. Apple has enough of a track record of getting rid of things, and people thinking it's absurd for them to do so, only within a few years for it to be obviously the right move. So I trust them a fair bit. One of the biggest examples of this is releasing a phone without physical keyboard. How absurd! There were several years of people insisting the iPhone was going to fail, or was inferior because it didn't have a physical keyboard like the Blackberry.
- illumin8 10y ago
  I use the same set of headphones with an Aune T1 DAC (I'm sure there are better ones out there, but I bought it a few years ago) and it works great. The thing I really like about this setup is that the DAC is class compliant, so it will work if I connect it to any iOS or MacOS device, although it requires a powered USB hub when I connect it to my iPad. It's kind of cool to have a lossless, high quality audio setup you can listen to with a mobile device, although I'll be the first to admit that you could spend a lot more money if you wanted to get a better setup.
guelo 10y ago
I don't want to deal with charging my headphones, managing remaining battery life, keeping track of another charging cable at home and work and travel, etc.
- dperfect 10y ago
  That's a fair point. Managing headphone battery life has been pretty easy for me, but of course not everyone is the same. Over-/around-/on-ear headphones tend to have pretty good batteries (the bigger size usually lends itself to longer-lasting batteries). In my case, with daily use of a few hours per day, I normally go for about two weeks before needing to charge my headphones, and even then, it's just a standard micro-USB for charging (I use the same cable for several other things anyway). The limitation/hassle with batteries is obviously more pronounced with earbuds / lightweight headphones since they'll require more frequent charging. Apple seems to be alleviating that frustration - at least somewhat - by combining charging with the carrying case. As charging becomes more transparent to the user (or integrated into their routine), the less of an issue it becomes.
iLoch 10y ago
Here's a concept: things that don't need to be charged. If Apple removes the headphone jacks from their computers I won't be buying their computers anymore.
- Zigurd 10y ago
  I charge a phone and two tablets, one of them a Kindle Fire. And I charge a watch. The nightstand full of charging things train has left the station for the kinds of customers who will adopt AirPods.
- DigitalJack 10y ago
  You must be pretty unhappy with Apple for such a thing to be the breaking point, or audio on your computer via headphones is super important to you? I only use it for conferencing. I use my phone for music, etc. Of course I could never be an audiophile, I have some hearing loss, so I have some built in tolerance to quality deficiencies simply because I couldn't discern them anyway. I'm actually afraid to use the audio jack on my MBPr. It grabs the adapter so hard I'm afraid something in the jack will break. This happened on my last MBP where the jack got stuck in audio mode due to some crappy little mechanical switch getting stuck or breaking in the jack.
- mitchty 10y ago
  The only headphones I have that connect via a headphone jack are active and need batteries. Which you could argue need charging as I use rechargeable batteries.
forgetsusername 10y ago
>many of the people I talk to just have experience with cheap (or older) Bluetooth audio devices Dollar for dollar you're going to get better sounding headphones with a 3.5mm connection than Bluetooth. So with price being equal it will be the Bluetooth cans that are inferior quality, every time. This is significant as a person for whom value per dollar is of utmost importance (and being wireless isn't).
- AstralStorm 10y ago
  Value is not the Apple brand. They are all about luxury.
  - forgetsusername 10y ago
    That might be their marketing message, but I think you'd be hard pressed to tell me how, exactly, Apple products are in any way more luxurious than other products on the market. Higher quality in some cases maybe, but I don't know about luxury. That said, it doesn't challenge the argument that at any price point, be it $100 or $10,000, you'll get better sound from hard wired cans. Is that not party of the luxury equation?
seltzered_ 10y ago
From googling around several times, I don't think aptX is supported by iPhone. Sure you're not using an AAC bluetooth codec?
- dperfect 10y ago
  You're right - I was mistaken (and will update my comment); the iPhone doesn't support aptX. Admittedly, I use the headphones more often with my MBP, but I haven't noticed any quality degradation when using my phone (as long as the source is a higher bitrate/quality).
illumin8 10y ago
Completely agree here. Anyone that is using a Mac for Pro Audio is using USB, Thunderbolt, or on older platforms, even Firewire to an external DAC. I have a pair of Jaybird X2 bluetooth headphones which are fine for consuming content, but when producing music I use an Apogee Duet connected to a pair of Yamaha HS-8 studio monitors.
cheald 10y ago
I'm happy with cheap earbuds, too, and don't have to worry about bad codecs. I'm sure the best experience would be Bluetooth with a $300 pair of headphones, but inexpensive/disposable is a feature people care about sometimes.
- tracker1 10y ago
  I'm kind of particular about headphones, there's only a handful I actually find comfortable, and charging is always painful for wireless, so I'd actually prefer analog, low-tech... the cost difference isn't worth it and greater chance of failure in my experience. Keep it simple already.
joeevans1000 10y ago
I am completely different on this one. I go to work in various places and shove a pair of high end wired headphones in my pack, and love the quality. I have been very unhappy with the best bluetooth out there. I realize I'm probably not representative of most consumers, but that's what the 'Pro' part of MacBook Pro stands for. Mainly, I'm not going to be shoving a DAC in my pack. The idea of not including such a tiny port is absurd, and I have to start wondering if it's not just all a business scheme. Either way, if they go this way, I'll most likely just bail on the entire ecosystem, and I think many people are teetering in that direction anyway at this point. In some ways, it will be wonderful, as there will be so many more people making linux work even better on Lenovo's and whatnot.

Corrado 10y ago

I agree. I'm using a brand new pair of Beats (I know, I know, but they came with the MBP) and they sound really good. A little bass heavy but that is not because of the Bluetooth connection. Now, maybe a BT connection won't satisfy the most professional audiophile, but they should probably be using an optical link anyway.

20yrs_no_equity 10y ago

For me, personally, anywhere that I want to plug in my ATH-M50x is somewhere that I'm not moving, so I don't mind a dongle. USB-c provides enough wattage to power an external DAC and if Apple does get rid of the headphone port on the next MacBook Pro, then that's what I'll buy. (Currently I plug the headphones into the headphone port at work, but at home I have a DAC/Amplifier plugged into my monitor's digital audio out, thus the mac's audio goes over HDMI.) I care enough about sound quality that these headphones are the only ones I'm interested in using for awhile. Apple has enough of a track record of getting rid of things, and people thinking it's absurd for them to do so, only within a few years for it to be obviously the right move. So I trust them a fair bit. One of the biggest examples of this is releasing a phone without physical keyboard. How absurd! There were several years of people insisting the iPhone was going to fail, or was inferior because it didn't have a physical keyboard like the Blackberry.

illumin8 10y ago
I use the same set of headphones with an Aune T1 DAC (I'm sure there are better ones out there, but I bought it a few years ago) and it works great. The thing I really like about this setup is that the DAC is class compliant, so it will work if I connect it to any iOS or MacOS device, although it requires a powered USB hub when I connect it to my iPad. It's kind of cool to have a lossless, high quality audio setup you can listen to with a mobile device, although I'll be the first to admit that you could spend a lot more money if you wanted to get a better setup.

guelo 10y ago

I don't want to deal with charging my headphones, managing remaining battery life, keeping track of another charging cable at home and work and travel, etc.

dperfect 10y ago
That's a fair point. Managing headphone battery life has been pretty easy for me, but of course not everyone is the same. Over-/around-/on-ear headphones tend to have pretty good batteries (the bigger size usually lends itself to longer-lasting batteries). In my case, with daily use of a few hours per day, I normally go for about two weeks before needing to charge my headphones, and even then, it's just a standard micro-USB for charging (I use the same cable for several other things anyway). The limitation/hassle with batteries is obviously more pronounced with earbuds / lightweight headphones since they'll require more frequent charging. Apple seems to be alleviating that frustration - at least somewhat - by combining charging with the carrying case. As charging becomes more transparent to the user (or integrated into their routine), the less of an issue it becomes.

iLoch 10y ago

Here's a concept: things that don't need to be charged. If Apple removes the headphone jacks from their computers I won't be buying their computers anymore.

Zigurd 10y ago
I charge a phone and two tablets, one of them a Kindle Fire. And I charge a watch. The nightstand full of charging things train has left the station for the kinds of customers who will adopt AirPods.
DigitalJack 10y ago
You must be pretty unhappy with Apple for such a thing to be the breaking point, or audio on your computer via headphones is super important to you? I only use it for conferencing. I use my phone for music, etc. Of course I could never be an audiophile, I have some hearing loss, so I have some built in tolerance to quality deficiencies simply because I couldn't discern them anyway. I'm actually afraid to use the audio jack on my MBPr. It grabs the adapter so hard I'm afraid something in the jack will break. This happened on my last MBP where the jack got stuck in audio mode due to some crappy little mechanical switch getting stuck or breaking in the jack.
mitchty 10y ago
The only headphones I have that connect via a headphone jack are active and need batteries. Which you could argue need charging as I use rechargeable batteries.

forgetsusername 10y ago

>many of the people I talk to just have experience with cheap (or older) Bluetooth audio devices Dollar for dollar you're going to get better sounding headphones with a 3.5mm connection than Bluetooth. So with price being equal it will be the Bluetooth cans that are inferior quality, every time. This is significant as a person for whom value per dollar is of utmost importance (and being wireless isn't).

AstralStorm 10y ago
Value is not the Apple brand. They are all about luxury.
- forgetsusername 10y ago
  That might be their marketing message, but I think you'd be hard pressed to tell me how, exactly, Apple products are in any way more luxurious than other products on the market. Higher quality in some cases maybe, but I don't know about luxury. That said, it doesn't challenge the argument that at any price point, be it $100 or $10,000, you'll get better sound from hard wired cans. Is that not party of the luxury equation?

seltzered_ 10y ago

From googling around several times, I don't think aptX is supported by iPhone. Sure you're not using an AAC bluetooth codec?

dperfect 10y ago
You're right - I was mistaken (and will update my comment); the iPhone doesn't support aptX. Admittedly, I use the headphones more often with my MBP, but I haven't noticed any quality degradation when using my phone (as long as the source is a higher bitrate/quality).

illumin8 10y ago

Completely agree here. Anyone that is using a Mac for Pro Audio is using USB, Thunderbolt, or on older platforms, even Firewire to an external DAC. I have a pair of Jaybird X2 bluetooth headphones which are fine for consuming content, but when producing music I use an Apogee Duet connected to a pair of Yamaha HS-8 studio monitors.

cheald 10y ago

I'm happy with cheap earbuds, too, and don't have to worry about bad codecs. I'm sure the best experience would be Bluetooth with a $300 pair of headphones, but inexpensive/disposable is a feature people care about sometimes.

tracker1 10y ago
I'm kind of particular about headphones, there's only a handful I actually find comfortable, and charging is always painful for wireless, so I'd actually prefer analog, low-tech... the cost difference isn't worth it and greater chance of failure in my experience. Keep it simple already.

joeevans1000 10y ago

I am completely different on this one. I go to work in various places and shove a pair of high end wired headphones in my pack, and love the quality. I have been very unhappy with the best bluetooth out there. I realize I'm probably not representative of most consumers, but that's what the 'Pro' part of MacBook Pro stands for. Mainly, I'm not going to be shoving a DAC in my pack. The idea of not including such a tiny port is absurd, and I have to start wondering if it's not just all a business scheme. Either way, if they go this way, I'll most likely just bail on the entire ecosystem, and I think many people are teetering in that direction anyway at this point. In some ways, it will be wonderful, as there will be so many more people making linux work even better on Lenovo's and whatnot.