7 ms·

Telling someone to smile feels closer to trying to cheer them up than any harassment.

by redorb 10y ago

poopsintub 10y ago
I don't feel like most of that is substantial enough either. Passed up for a promotion is likely when the company is mostly men. Reporting bad jokes, nagging, and "smile" would result in hr pinning you as a problem employee even if they crossed the line, which the rape one obviously did. No one is going to tell you an employee was reprimanded, either way. Going to hr not to mention the Ceo seems more than a bit ticky tacky and outrageous. You're going to quit over this? There has to be more to the story At what level of education and employment do you quit and ride a bycicle? Too many questions about an article way, way too vague.
jsmith0295 10y ago
Or just something someone would say to someone in a hallway just to say something. People have said things like that to me plenty of times before, and I'm assuming it probably wasn't because they mistook me for a woman.
Blackthorn 10y ago
Don't ever do this to a woman. It's not going to cheer them up. They've been putting up with that crap their whole lives, and all you accomplish by telling them that is to add to the load of crap.
- protomyth 10y ago
  Don't do it to a guy either. I've put up with this crap and frankly you are just another brick in the wall. People often have resting faces that look unhappy.
noobermin 10y ago
"You alright?" Or less insinuating, "how are things?" works better.
rdtsc 10y ago
It completely depends how it is said, the tone and the non-verbals. It can be creepy and sexist as well. Some component of it is not just that it was a man vs woman but that it was a manager. Then it can feel patronizing. "Come on! Amuse me with your smile. I don't want to have frowning reports. If you don't smile, no good review at the end of the month" kind of idea Besides cheering someone up by telling them to smile is like telling a quiet person that they are so quiet. Haven't seen that ever help except make the person even more quiet.
strict9 10y ago
How often are you told to smile? How do [would] you react to someone telling you what emotion to feel, much less to outwardly convey, regardless of what's actually going on inside you? It's offensive and inexcusable, regardless of gender or intent.
- flukus 10y ago
  > It's offensive and inexcusable, regardless of gender or intent. How? It's a common everyday saying.
  - nharada 10y ago
    It's no longer a common everyday saying because it's become synonymous with the sinister sexist undertones that it implies. It's like asking someone to "Netflix and Chill" today vs 3 years ago. At some point it may not have only meant one thing but those days have passed.
    - flukus 10y ago
      > It's no longer a common everyday saying because it's become synonymous with the sinister sexist undertones that it implies. This is quite literally the first I've ever heard this. Is there an official list of what we can and can't say anywhere?
      - Blackthorn 10y ago
        > This is quite literally the first I've ever heard this. Then it's good that you heard about it now, so you don't do it to anyone in the future! Here's some references to better understand why this is a bad thing: * http://www.huffingtonpost.com/erika-hardison/its-important-for-men-to-stop-telling-women-to-smile_b_9655246.html http://www.huffingtonpost.com/erika-hardison/its-important-f... * http://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2016/04/09/473433505/why-telling-a-woman-to-smile-makes-her-want-to-scream http://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2016/04/09/47343350...
fl0wenol 10y ago
Even if you are friendly with the person giving the comment, it strikes me as a very self-centered thing to say. It translates into: "I don't like seeing your face unhappy." To which I (or anyone) might reply: "Well, I'm having a shit day and you're not helping. So... tough!" It would be more appropriate to say nothing if you don't know the person or don't have time to ask if anything is the matter.

Telling someone to smile feels closer to trying to cheer them up than any harassment.

by redorb 10y ago

Telling someone to smile feels closer to trying to cheer them up than any harassment.

I don't feel like most of that is substantial enough either. Passed up for a promotion is likely when the company is mostly men. Reporting bad jokes, nagging, and "smile" would result in hr pinning you as a problem employee even if they crossed the line, which the rape one obviously did. No one is going to tell you an employee was reprimanded, either way. Going to hr not to mention the Ceo seems more than a bit ticky tacky and outrageous. You're going to quit over this? There has to be more to the story At what level of education and employment do you quit and ride a bycicle? Too many questions about an article way, way too vague.

jsmith0295 10y ago

Or just something someone would say to someone in a hallway just to say something. People have said things like that to me plenty of times before, and I'm assuming it probably wasn't because they mistook me for a woman.

Blackthorn 10y ago

Don't ever do this to a woman. It's not going to cheer them up. They've been putting up with that crap their whole lives, and all you accomplish by telling them that is to add to the load of crap.

protomyth 10y ago
Don't do it to a guy either. I've put up with this crap and frankly you are just another brick in the wall. People often have resting faces that look unhappy.

noobermin 10y ago

"You alright?" Or less insinuating, "how are things?" works better.

rdtsc 10y ago

It completely depends how it is said, the tone and the non-verbals. It can be creepy and sexist as well. Some component of it is not just that it was a man vs woman but that it was a manager. Then it can feel patronizing. "Come on! Amuse me with your smile. I don't want to have frowning reports. If you don't smile, no good review at the end of the month" kind of idea Besides cheering someone up by telling them to smile is like telling a quiet person that they are so quiet. Haven't seen that ever help except make the person even more quiet.

strict9 10y ago

How often are you told to smile? How do [would] you react to someone telling you what emotion to feel, much less to outwardly convey, regardless of what's actually going on inside you? It's offensive and inexcusable, regardless of gender or intent.

flukus 10y ago
> It's offensive and inexcusable, regardless of gender or intent. How? It's a common everyday saying.
- nharada 10y ago
  It's no longer a common everyday saying because it's become synonymous with the sinister sexist undertones that it implies. It's like asking someone to "Netflix and Chill" today vs 3 years ago. At some point it may not have only meant one thing but those days have passed.
  - flukus 10y ago
    > It's no longer a common everyday saying because it's become synonymous with the sinister sexist undertones that it implies. This is quite literally the first I've ever heard this. Is there an official list of what we can and can't say anywhere?
    - Blackthorn 10y ago
      > This is quite literally the first I've ever heard this. Then it's good that you heard about it now, so you don't do it to anyone in the future! Here's some references to better understand why this is a bad thing: * http://www.huffingtonpost.com/erika-hardison/its-important-for-men-to-stop-telling-women-to-smile_b_9655246.html http://www.huffingtonpost.com/erika-hardison/its-important-f... * http://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2016/04/09/473433505/why-telling-a-woman-to-smile-makes-her-want-to-scream http://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2016/04/09/47343350...

fl0wenol 10y ago

Even if you are friendly with the person giving the comment, it strikes me as a very self-centered thing to say. It translates into: "I don't like seeing your face unhappy." To which I (or anyone) might reply: "Well, I'm having a shit day and you're not helping. So... tough!" It would be more appropriate to say nothing if you don't know the person or don't have time to ask if anything is the matter.