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Bootcamps in our industry are a fraud and I sure hope that such fraudulent activities aren't the answer to a classic college education. And online courses don'

Bootcamps in our industry are a fraud and I sure hope that such fraudulent activities aren't the answer to a classic college education. And online courses don't work well, being effective only on adults that already have an education. You can talk about disruption all you want, but there's no substitute for an old fashioned college education. And in many European countries this education is subsidised by the state. Even in the US college would be affordable if you would cut the evil from its source and that would be college loans.

swagasaurus-rex 10y ago
The web development consulting agency I work for has been hiring a good number of individuals who have been trained for development at a bootcamp. The demand for developers exceeds the supply and companies are willing to take on the burden of training.
yodsanklai 10y ago
> And online courses don't work well, being effective only on adults that already have an education. Even in that case, I wouldn't put a coursera certificate on my resume. They are watered-down versions of good college courses and they're not really selective.
- chrisseaton 10y ago
  I'll proudly put my Coursera machine learning certificate on my resume next time I update it, right after my PhD and MEng. It shows I'm still seeking out ways to learn more and keep current. It would make a good impression on me if I was reviewing someone else's resume as well.
mafribe 10y ago
effective only on adults that already have an education. Why is that a bad thing? It's already a sizable demographic, and one that self-selects for being interested in education.
- bad_user 10y ago
  I disagree with "self-selects for being interested in education". Most people learn by direct interaction with other people or their teacher, which is the problem of MOOCs. It would be more accurate to say that online education works for autodidacts. And don't get me wrong, that still has a lot of value and I've enjoyed my online courses greatly. But it simply can't be a replacement for a classic college education, which was what we were talking about.
  - mafribe 10y ago
    Most people learn by direct interaction I'll have to disagree here. I've been a university teacher for over a decade, and the number of students who interact with me is small. Most students don't actually interact with others all that much in learning. Neither did I as an undergraduate or pupil. I'm not saying that's a good thing, but that's a fact. Most learning is auto-didactic in some form or shape. What universities offer is deadlines and penalities for missed deadlines. Those are anti-procrastionation scaffolds that most people (including myself) need for effective long-term learning. MOOCs mostly lack this, and that why MOOCs have not yet replaced conventional schools and universities.

swagasaurus-rex 10y ago

The web development consulting agency I work for has been hiring a good number of individuals who have been trained for development at a bootcamp. The demand for developers exceeds the supply and companies are willing to take on the burden of training.

yodsanklai 10y ago

> And online courses don't work well, being effective only on adults that already have an education. Even in that case, I wouldn't put a coursera certificate on my resume. They are watered-down versions of good college courses and they're not really selective.

chrisseaton 10y ago
I'll proudly put my Coursera machine learning certificate on my resume next time I update it, right after my PhD and MEng. It shows I'm still seeking out ways to learn more and keep current. It would make a good impression on me if I was reviewing someone else's resume as well.

mafribe 10y ago

effective only on adults that already have an education. Why is that a bad thing? It's already a sizable demographic, and one that self-selects for being interested in education.

bad_user 10y ago
I disagree with "self-selects for being interested in education". Most people learn by direct interaction with other people or their teacher, which is the problem of MOOCs. It would be more accurate to say that online education works for autodidacts. And don't get me wrong, that still has a lot of value and I've enjoyed my online courses greatly. But it simply can't be a replacement for a classic college education, which was what we were talking about.
- mafribe 10y ago
  Most people learn by direct interaction I'll have to disagree here. I've been a university teacher for over a decade, and the number of students who interact with me is small. Most students don't actually interact with others all that much in learning. Neither did I as an undergraduate or pupil. I'm not saying that's a good thing, but that's a fact. Most learning is auto-didactic in some form or shape. What universities offer is deadlines and penalities for missed deadlines. Those are anti-procrastionation scaffolds that most people (including myself) need for effective long-term learning. MOOCs mostly lack this, and that why MOOCs have not yet replaced conventional schools and universities.