3 ms·

I would note squid and octopus have fine manipulators (tentacles) and they are relatively intelligent.

by meric 10y ago

tbarbugli 10y ago
Luckily for us their life span (at least for octopus) is really short :)
dharma1 10y ago
I've often wondered if we had suitable computer-brain interfaces, could we harness octopus brains to process various computational workloads. Like a squishy co-processor
- lawless123 10y ago
  I wonder could we do the same with humans.
- wuschel 10y ago
  sarcasm on Don't forget, human brains are squishy, too, and there are many more of them! Sarcasm off Not sure if your comment meant to be provocative, or if you just did not think through the ethical considerations of your statement. In fact, I am not sure how well protected octupus as a species are, since they lack a spine.
  - dharma1 10y ago
    I was half joking, but I think there is something to be said for biological computation far beyond the capabilities of silicon, that we may be able to ultimately harness with better BCIs (brain-computer interface). Imagine Goldman Sachs running market predictions on huge banks of invertebrates hooked up to neural network HFT algorithms, literally earning the name "vampire squid" :) I think the ethics of something like this is a very challenging area. Legally, cephalopods already enjoy some protection in the EU against scientific experiments that can cause pain - http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:L:2010:276:0033:0079:EN:PDF http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:L:2... However we readily eat squid and octopus, to the point of endangering them. We breed chicken and other animals in factories, in the case of battery hen from hatching to killing them in 72 weeks max (about 10% of their normal life span), in often horrific conditions. Would using octopuses be more ethical than chimps, since they lack a spine and are genetically further from us? What if the octopuses were bred on a farm instead of captured in the wild? What if instead of whole animals, just the nervous system structures were grown in culture?
    - wuschel 10y ago
      Thank you for your reply, and making your position understandable. In my humble opinion science has already a problem with communicating to the general public. We are still far away from the comprehension of state, or even computuation in living tissue. The technology underlying silicium based computers is quite primitive compared to biologics. Certainly - these are interesting thoughts in theory - but for the sake of science communications with the general public I am very careful in what context and what way I would articulate these concepts. Animal welfare, and the health of ecosystems, is definitely another minefield of a discussion.
- deftnerd 10y ago
  I'm not sure about computational, but their optics and the part of the brain that processes it is well used to low light conditions and navigating in space where there isn't just an X and Y axis, but also a Z axis. Octopus are familiar with scuttling around on the seafloor and navigating around crazy terrain. Squid are used to using jet propulsion. I've always thought that both species would be interesting to emulate in silicon for space exploration purposes.

I would note squid and octopus have fine manipulators (tentacles) and they are relatively intelligent.

by meric 10y ago

I would note squid and octopus have fine manipulators (tentacles) and they are relatively intelligent.

tbarbugli 10y ago

Luckily for us their life span (at least for octopus) is really short :)

dharma1 10y ago

I've often wondered if we had suitable computer-brain interfaces, could we harness octopus brains to process various computational workloads. Like a squishy co-processor

lawless123 10y ago
I wonder could we do the same with humans.
wuschel 10y ago
sarcasm on Don't forget, human brains are squishy, too, and there are many more of them! Sarcasm off Not sure if your comment meant to be provocative, or if you just did not think through the ethical considerations of your statement. In fact, I am not sure how well protected octupus as a species are, since they lack a spine.
- dharma1 10y ago
  I was half joking, but I think there is something to be said for biological computation far beyond the capabilities of silicon, that we may be able to ultimately harness with better BCIs (brain-computer interface). Imagine Goldman Sachs running market predictions on huge banks of invertebrates hooked up to neural network HFT algorithms, literally earning the name "vampire squid" :) I think the ethics of something like this is a very challenging area. Legally, cephalopods already enjoy some protection in the EU against scientific experiments that can cause pain - http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:L:2010:276:0033:0079:EN:PDF http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:L:2... However we readily eat squid and octopus, to the point of endangering them. We breed chicken and other animals in factories, in the case of battery hen from hatching to killing them in 72 weeks max (about 10% of their normal life span), in often horrific conditions. Would using octopuses be more ethical than chimps, since they lack a spine and are genetically further from us? What if the octopuses were bred on a farm instead of captured in the wild? What if instead of whole animals, just the nervous system structures were grown in culture?
  - wuschel 10y ago
    Thank you for your reply, and making your position understandable. In my humble opinion science has already a problem with communicating to the general public. We are still far away from the comprehension of state, or even computuation in living tissue. The technology underlying silicium based computers is quite primitive compared to biologics. Certainly - these are interesting thoughts in theory - but for the sake of science communications with the general public I am very careful in what context and what way I would articulate these concepts. Animal welfare, and the health of ecosystems, is definitely another minefield of a discussion.
deftnerd 10y ago
I'm not sure about computational, but their optics and the part of the brain that processes it is well used to low light conditions and navigating in space where there isn't just an X and Y axis, but also a Z axis. Octopus are familiar with scuttling around on the seafloor and navigating around crazy terrain. Squid are used to using jet propulsion. I've always thought that both species would be interesting to emulate in silicon for space exploration purposes.