4 ms·

For me, the only espresso which comes close to the Italian original (I visit southern Europe every year) is served at Eataly (the Flatiron location in Manhattan

by jazzyk 10y ago

For me, the only espresso which comes close to the Italian original (I visit southern Europe every year) is served at Eataly (the Flatiron location in Manhattan). I've tried many smaller coffeshops in Manhattan and Boston - often highly rated on Yelp - but they are not even close. Always a bit burnt or sour - a well done espresso is neither.

nickbauman 10y ago
That just blew my mind. My company had it's main office in the same building as Eataly as recently as 6 months ago. I've never been inside Eataly, kept meaning to! Grrr...
saryant 10y ago
I've found that there is no correlation between Yelp ratings of a coffeeshop and actual coffee quality. It's just not what reviewers are necessarily looking for, especially compared to things like power outlets and ambience.
- tedmiston 10y ago
  There's an app called Work Hard Anywhere that breaks down all of these other factors for a coffee shop in a way that Yelp doesn't. So if you only want to see the highest rated coffee at places with wifi, you can run that query. http://workhardanywhere.com http://workhardanywhere.com Disclosure: I've been a beta tester for a while; I use it a lot.
siegecraft 10y ago
Doesn't Eataly have various vendors so there's no guarantee that you're getting espresso from the right one? I'm going to be vacationing in the area soon and getting good espresso is on my list.
- jazzyk 10y ago
  It has a variety of stands with all sorts of food. But the front coffee shop (and I think the only dedicated one) is great.
lytfyre 10y ago
There are different styles of espresso, with roasters and barista optimizing for very different tastes - the Italian/Mediterranean style is one, the "third wave" style that's more prevalent on the North American west coast and Australia (Seattle/Portland/Melbourne/London UK) is another, and Scandinavian/Northern European being a third. Then there's the many people who go to a coffee shop for a drink with a ton of syrup in it, so don't really get as much impact off the taste of the coffee, and will generally care more about the atmosphere and service. Between the two factors, general audience reviews like Yelp lose a lot of their value if you're particular about your coffee.
- tedmiston 10y ago
  Searching Foursquare / Yelp for "third wave coffee" vs "coffee" tends to turn up more relevant results for me. (But I still don't pay much attention to star ratings.)
- gwynplaine 10y ago
  Completely agree, Italian espresso was considered great decades ago, but standards have risen faster elsewhere since then. Italy still makes the best espresso _machines_ such as Simonelli. My experience of coffee there is coffee roasted so dark as to be considered burnt. See the World Barista Championship winners, not a single Italian yet, unfortunately. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Barista_Championship https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Barista_Championship
  - lytfyre 10y ago
    > Italy still makes the best espresso _machines_ such as Simonelli Even that I think they're losing ground on - Slayer or Synesso out of Seattle, or Mod Bar out of Indiana are pretty great, certainly right up there with any Simonelli or La Marzoco. For consumer level espresso machines, I think Breville (Australian) has been blowing away just about everything under 2k$. It's been interesting to watch them bring more modern control tech into the cheap market.
    - arcticfox 10y ago

by jazzyk 10y ago

nickbauman 10y ago

That just blew my mind. My company had it's main office in the same building as Eataly as recently as 6 months ago. I've never been inside Eataly, kept meaning to! Grrr...

saryant 10y ago

I've found that there is no correlation between Yelp ratings of a coffeeshop and actual coffee quality. It's just not what reviewers are necessarily looking for, especially compared to things like power outlets and ambience.

tedmiston 10y ago
There's an app called Work Hard Anywhere that breaks down all of these other factors for a coffee shop in a way that Yelp doesn't. So if you only want to see the highest rated coffee at places with wifi, you can run that query. http://workhardanywhere.com http://workhardanywhere.com Disclosure: I've been a beta tester for a while; I use it a lot.

siegecraft 10y ago

Doesn't Eataly have various vendors so there's no guarantee that you're getting espresso from the right one? I'm going to be vacationing in the area soon and getting good espresso is on my list.

jazzyk 10y ago
It has a variety of stands with all sorts of food. But the front coffee shop (and I think the only dedicated one) is great.

lytfyre 10y ago

There are different styles of espresso, with roasters and barista optimizing for very different tastes - the Italian/Mediterranean style is one, the "third wave" style that's more prevalent on the North American west coast and Australia (Seattle/Portland/Melbourne/London UK) is another, and Scandinavian/Northern European being a third. Then there's the many people who go to a coffee shop for a drink with a ton of syrup in it, so don't really get as much impact off the taste of the coffee, and will generally care more about the atmosphere and service. Between the two factors, general audience reviews like Yelp lose a lot of their value if you're particular about your coffee.

tedmiston 10y ago
Searching Foursquare / Yelp for "third wave coffee" vs "coffee" tends to turn up more relevant results for me. (But I still don't pay much attention to star ratings.)
gwynplaine 10y ago
Completely agree, Italian espresso was considered great decades ago, but standards have risen faster elsewhere since then. Italy still makes the best espresso _machines_ such as Simonelli. My experience of coffee there is coffee roasted so dark as to be considered burnt. See the World Barista Championship winners, not a single Italian yet, unfortunately. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Barista_Championship https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Barista_Championship
- lytfyre 10y ago
  > Italy still makes the best espresso _machines_ such as Simonelli Even that I think they're losing ground on - Slayer or Synesso out of Seattle, or Mod Bar out of Indiana are pretty great, certainly right up there with any Simonelli or La Marzoco. For consumer level espresso machines, I think Breville (Australian) has been blowing away just about everything under 2k$. It's been interesting to watch them bring more modern control tech into the cheap market.
  - arcticfox 10y ago