4 ms·

> I'd further like to be able to query that database as a civilian. You are not entitled to know the details of my private property, similar to how a civilian

by xtreme 10y ago

> I'd further like to be able to query that database as a civilian. You are not entitled to know the details of my private property, similar to how a civilian can't access a list of cars you own. More pragmatically, this can lead to increased crime. Owners of valuable firearms would be targeted by burglars. A robber would easily know which homeowners don't have any guns, and would target them with less risk.

spdustin 10y ago
I can see, in some ways, the point of being targeted by burglars. The same burglars who see the box of your new big screen tv on trash day (or dive for receipts), or who case your house for a few weeks before Christmas to see what you;re unloading from your car. I would think that a thief would be less interested to steal from someone who is, by virtue of owning a gun, equipped to defend his or her property with lethal force. I honesty don't see this as a threat vector, unless I'm missing something. What am I missing? I admit ignorance here, and please don't mistake my responses as an argument. If this is a legitimate concern, I'd like to know. I'd hate to think my opinion was uninformed.
- hga 10y ago
  I would think that a thief would be less interested to steal from someone who is, by virtue of owning a gun, equipped to defend his or her property with lethal force. What you're missing is that in the US, criminals in almost all the states and cities know there's a good chance their targets have guns in their homes, so they generally choose to burglarize them when unoccupied.
  - vkou 10y ago
    They also prefer to do so in countries other then the US, because they are there to burgle, not to get into a potentially dangerous altercation with the resident. Nothing good will come out of burgling an occupied house. 1. You may be identified - this will quickly shut down your criminal career. 2. You may be physically harmed. 3. You may physically harm the resident, which will turn your crime from a police-don't-really-care burglary into a violent robbery.
- xenophonf 10y ago
  Your hypothetical robber would need to conduct labor-intensive physical surveillance operations in order to ascertain which houses on which streets had big screen TV boxes outside on their respective trash days. Big screen TV purchases are rare events due the cost and longevity of said devices, so this becomes a statistical sampling problem: One may need to spend several months driving through target neighborhoods on their respective trash days in order to discover a house with a big screen TV box outside it, at which point your hypothetical robber has done two things: 1. Engaged in suspicious behavior that increases the risk of arrest. 2. Spent more in food, fuel, vehicle maintenance, and opportunity costs than the expected value of a stolen big screen TV (which would sell well below its retail price because of its questionable provenance). Let's say instead, for the sake of argument, that consumers must register their big screen TV purchases with the government. (Some governments, notably the UK, use such registrations to tax consumers in order to pay for public broadcasting.) If such a registry were publicly searchable, your hypothetical robber could conduct their surveillance from the safety and anonymity of the parking lot of the local Starbucks or McDonald's. This significantly lowers the robber's surveillance costs/risks, as they no longer have to spend hours driving fruitlessly through random neighborhoods, only to be ratted out by some nosy busybody itching to call the police whenever the least little thing is out of place on their cul-de-sac. Furthermore, a sufficiently intelligent robber may automate said searches, further lowering their costs/risks. Now, given the above, let's say some poor sod is off on holiday, washing their cares away with mojitos and all-you-can-eat buffets, when your hypothetical robber steals their big screen TV---only to use it to commit some assault the day our rum-soaked homeowner returns to the good ol' USA (who collapses into bed without noticing the theft). And by "assault" I mean something REALLY heinous, like setting it up in front of a daycare playing Rick Astley on infinite repeat with the volume at 11. Think of the children! When the cops investigate, of course they will search the big screen TV registry and find said homeowner, who in the midst of the DTs discovers he has no alibi. And so it goes.
  - spdustin 10y ago
    Well said! You've changed my mind on public access to such a database, if it comes to pass. Excellent points made.

by xtreme 10y ago

spdustin 10y ago

I can see, in some ways, the point of being targeted by burglars. The same burglars who see the box of your new big screen tv on trash day (or dive for receipts), or who case your house for a few weeks before Christmas to see what you;re unloading from your car. I would think that a thief would be less interested to steal from someone who is, by virtue of owning a gun, equipped to defend his or her property with lethal force. I honesty don't see this as a threat vector, unless I'm missing something. What am I missing? I admit ignorance here, and please don't mistake my responses as an argument. If this is a legitimate concern, I'd like to know. I'd hate to think my opinion was uninformed.

hga 10y ago
I would think that a thief would be less interested to steal from someone who is, by virtue of owning a gun, equipped to defend his or her property with lethal force. What you're missing is that in the US, criminals in almost all the states and cities know there's a good chance their targets have guns in their homes, so they generally choose to burglarize them when unoccupied.
- vkou 10y ago
  They also prefer to do so in countries other then the US, because they are there to burgle, not to get into a potentially dangerous altercation with the resident. Nothing good will come out of burgling an occupied house. 1. You may be identified - this will quickly shut down your criminal career. 2. You may be physically harmed. 3. You may physically harm the resident, which will turn your crime from a police-don't-really-care burglary into a violent robbery.
xenophonf 10y ago
Your hypothetical robber would need to conduct labor-intensive physical surveillance operations in order to ascertain which houses on which streets had big screen TV boxes outside on their respective trash days. Big screen TV purchases are rare events due the cost and longevity of said devices, so this becomes a statistical sampling problem: One may need to spend several months driving through target neighborhoods on their respective trash days in order to discover a house with a big screen TV box outside it, at which point your hypothetical robber has done two things: 1. Engaged in suspicious behavior that increases the risk of arrest. 2. Spent more in food, fuel, vehicle maintenance, and opportunity costs than the expected value of a stolen big screen TV (which would sell well below its retail price because of its questionable provenance). Let's say instead, for the sake of argument, that consumers must register their big screen TV purchases with the government. (Some governments, notably the UK, use such registrations to tax consumers in order to pay for public broadcasting.) If such a registry were publicly searchable, your hypothetical robber could conduct their surveillance from the safety and anonymity of the parking lot of the local Starbucks or McDonald's. This significantly lowers the robber's surveillance costs/risks, as they no longer have to spend hours driving fruitlessly through random neighborhoods, only to be ratted out by some nosy busybody itching to call the police whenever the least little thing is out of place on their cul-de-sac. Furthermore, a sufficiently intelligent robber may automate said searches, further lowering their costs/risks. Now, given the above, let's say some poor sod is off on holiday, washing their cares away with mojitos and all-you-can-eat buffets, when your hypothetical robber steals their big screen TV---only to use it to commit some assault the day our rum-soaked homeowner returns to the good ol' USA (who collapses into bed without noticing the theft). And by "assault" I mean something REALLY heinous, like setting it up in front of a daycare playing Rick Astley on infinite repeat with the volume at 11. Think of the children! When the cops investigate, of course they will search the big screen TV registry and find said homeowner, who in the midst of the DTs discovers he has no alibi. And so it goes.
- spdustin 10y ago
  Well said! You've changed my mind on public access to such a database, if it comes to pass. Excellent points made.