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Although it was the CIA=led coup of the democratically elected government that led conditions to go so extreme with the Islamic Republic and Anti-Western sentim

Although it was the CIA=led coup of the democratically elected government that led conditions to go so extreme with the Islamic Republic and Anti-Western sentiments

bobcostas55 10y ago
"Democratically elected" is one of those wonderful phrases, like "(People's) Democratic Republic" that always means the exact opposite of what the words mean. Mossadegh never won a popular election. He became Prime Minister by assassinating the previous guy, the Parliament then made him Prime Minister. After he got power, he pardoned the assassin, btw.
- aburan28 10y ago
  Well surely supporting the Shah and the absolute brutality conducted by Savak helped our image
  - eternalban 10y ago
    Did you actually experience the "brutality of [S.A.V.A.K.]" first hand or is this something you've read? One of my uncles, pretty high up in the Tudeh (Communist) Party, spent two tours in Shah's prisons as a political prisoner. He also spent one tour in the Ayatollahs' prisons for the same issue: being a communist. A few years ago, when he came visiting States side, I asked him about it. What he told me was that the Shah's prisons were a joke compared to the ones run by IRI. I have fond memories of him from the late 70s as a very self confident and charming man. Per family gossip, after his release from IRI's prisons he barely said a word for 2 years and was broken. As for "image", it may interest the younger HN reader to know that the very meme of "Shah the brutal dictator" started in the early 70s in the West, with the (finally) now fully established role played by "human rights" organizations that are fronts for Western intelligence services. Yes, SAVAK is a dark stain, having been trained by FBI and MOSSAD contrary to long standing Iranian mores and standards of conduct. But I can point you to youtube videos of public trials of political prisoners during the Shah's regime and challenge you to produce ONE for the multitude of ("brutalized") political prisoners now held in Guantanemo and other undisclosed locations.
  - Paradigma11 10y ago
    The Shah ruled for 25 years. That's a lot of time. The first 10 years were quite ok with a steady decline and pretty horrible last 5 years.
- aminok 10y ago
  The previous Prime Minister died in 1964: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hossein_Ala%27 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hossein_Ala%27 Mossadeq became Prime Minister in 1952. So he did not become Prime Minister by assassinating the previous guy. The predecessor of Mossadeq's predecessor was assassinated however: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haj_Ali_Razmara https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haj_Ali_Razmara I have seen no evidence it was by Mossadeq. The assassin was a member of an extremist Islamic group, not Mossadeq's secular National Front. You are right as far as him being released during Mossadeq's administration but there are many possible explanations for his release other than Mossadeq playing a role in the assassination. There were many other factions and political movements at play at that time. As far as I know Mossadeq was not an especially violent man. He had the option of putting down the protests that led to his deposition but refused to give the order.
Paradigma11 10y ago
If you read the original transcripts and testimonies you will see that the role of the CIA was nowhere as dominant and succesful in this power struggle as widely prpagated. Actually the CIA was of the opinion that the coup had failed and the state department already started to draft communications to Mossadegh when, on the next day, surprisingly people went to the street for the Shah. I guess the narrative of the evil, efficient and powerful CIA suits the US goverment as much as it does Iran.

Although it was the CIA=led coup of the democratically elected government that led conditions to go so extreme with the Islamic Republic and Anti-Western sentiments

bobcostas55 10y ago

"Democratically elected" is one of those wonderful phrases, like "(People's) Democratic Republic" that always means the exact opposite of what the words mean. Mossadegh never won a popular election. He became Prime Minister by assassinating the previous guy, the Parliament then made him Prime Minister. After he got power, he pardoned the assassin, btw.

aburan28 10y ago
Well surely supporting the Shah and the absolute brutality conducted by Savak helped our image
- eternalban 10y ago
  Did you actually experience the "brutality of [S.A.V.A.K.]" first hand or is this something you've read? One of my uncles, pretty high up in the Tudeh (Communist) Party, spent two tours in Shah's prisons as a political prisoner. He also spent one tour in the Ayatollahs' prisons for the same issue: being a communist. A few years ago, when he came visiting States side, I asked him about it. What he told me was that the Shah's prisons were a joke compared to the ones run by IRI. I have fond memories of him from the late 70s as a very self confident and charming man. Per family gossip, after his release from IRI's prisons he barely said a word for 2 years and was broken. As for "image", it may interest the younger HN reader to know that the very meme of "Shah the brutal dictator" started in the early 70s in the West, with the (finally) now fully established role played by "human rights" organizations that are fronts for Western intelligence services. Yes, SAVAK is a dark stain, having been trained by FBI and MOSSAD contrary to long standing Iranian mores and standards of conduct. But I can point you to youtube videos of public trials of political prisoners during the Shah's regime and challenge you to produce ONE for the multitude of ("brutalized") political prisoners now held in Guantanemo and other undisclosed locations.
- Paradigma11 10y ago
  The Shah ruled for 25 years. That's a lot of time. The first 10 years were quite ok with a steady decline and pretty horrible last 5 years.
aminok 10y ago
The previous Prime Minister died in 1964: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hossein_Ala%27 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hossein_Ala%27 Mossadeq became Prime Minister in 1952. So he did not become Prime Minister by assassinating the previous guy. The predecessor of Mossadeq's predecessor was assassinated however: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haj_Ali_Razmara https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haj_Ali_Razmara I have seen no evidence it was by Mossadeq. The assassin was a member of an extremist Islamic group, not Mossadeq's secular National Front. You are right as far as him being released during Mossadeq's administration but there are many possible explanations for his release other than Mossadeq playing a role in the assassination. There were many other factions and political movements at play at that time. As far as I know Mossadeq was not an especially violent man. He had the option of putting down the protests that led to his deposition but refused to give the order.

Paradigma11 10y ago

If you read the original transcripts and testimonies you will see that the role of the CIA was nowhere as dominant and succesful in this power struggle as widely prpagated. Actually the CIA was of the opinion that the coup had failed and the state department already started to draft communications to Mossadegh when, on the next day, surprisingly people went to the street for the Shah. I guess the narrative of the evil, efficient and powerful CIA suits the US goverment as much as it does Iran.