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I understand that picture very well. Thanks for bringing it up. I really think equality of opportunity should exist beyond social lines like gender, race, disa

by NTDF9 10y ago

I understand that picture very well. Thanks for bringing it up. I really think equality of opportunity should exist beyond social lines like gender, race, disabilities etc. But equality of outcome? Why? Why should everyone have equal outcome? What is the reward for hard work then? Why be a good person if being a bad one will bring the same outcome? When everyone starts with the same opportunities, the hardworker, smartworker, dedicated, persistent deserves more than the lazy, douchebag, not dedicated, not doing something themselves and always wanting others to do things for them. Don't you agree?

chillacy 10y ago
I agree that equal outcome is undesirable. But if you truly had equal opportunity for something universally desired, let's say higher education, you would expect to see in your freshman class across all colleges a distribution matching the general population in all these factors, like gender/race/disabilities, and I would add wealth too. But when we look at these distributions we see some under represented, and some over represented. That seems to imply that there wasn't equal opportunity, or there's different desirability among the groups (e.g. maybe 90% of very tall people would rather play NBA basketball than go to college).
- ebfe 10y ago
  >you would expect to see in your freshman class across all colleges a distribution matching the general population in all these factors, like gender/race/disabilities Why would you expect this? The mean IQ of black Americans is a standard deviation below that of Asians. Surely you would expect to see relatively fewer of them.
  - reitanqild 10y ago
    > Why would you expect this? The mean IQ of black Americans is a standard deviation below that of Asians Kind of agree here - but (and I'm saying this as someone who scores well in th IQ system and hold a well paid, technical job): * why is it like this? I have nothing to back it up but I have a strong hunch that this difference might at least be partially attributed to something else than biology. I don't say "white oppression in 2016" but I fear that part of it is "learned helplessness" from centuries gone. * why is it that university should be the best option for everyone (and that includes me)? Some of the very best techies I have worked with have gone the route of assistant technician-> technician -> add maths, physics, economy etc (because now they are motivated for it) -> fantastic boss, pm, technical lead etc.

by NTDF9 10y ago

chillacy 10y ago

I agree that equal outcome is undesirable. But if you truly had equal opportunity for something universally desired, let's say higher education, you would expect to see in your freshman class across all colleges a distribution matching the general population in all these factors, like gender/race/disabilities, and I would add wealth too. But when we look at these distributions we see some under represented, and some over represented. That seems to imply that there wasn't equal opportunity, or there's different desirability among the groups (e.g. maybe 90% of very tall people would rather play NBA basketball than go to college).

ebfe 10y ago
>you would expect to see in your freshman class across all colleges a distribution matching the general population in all these factors, like gender/race/disabilities Why would you expect this? The mean IQ of black Americans is a standard deviation below that of Asians. Surely you would expect to see relatively fewer of them.
- reitanqild 10y ago
  > Why would you expect this? The mean IQ of black Americans is a standard deviation below that of Asians Kind of agree here - but (and I'm saying this as someone who scores well in th IQ system and hold a well paid, technical job): * why is it like this? I have nothing to back it up but I have a strong hunch that this difference might at least be partially attributed to something else than biology. I don't say "white oppression in 2016" but I fear that part of it is "learned helplessness" from centuries gone. * why is it that university should be the best option for everyone (and that includes me)? Some of the very best techies I have worked with have gone the route of assistant technician-> technician -> add maths, physics, economy etc (because now they are motivated for it) -> fantastic boss, pm, technical lead etc.