3 ms·

I think that's the point, not the irony: "we believe in an actual deity who does various things, whereas elite Westerners believe in a manufacturer of gadgets."

by asolove 17y ago

hugh3 17y ago
At least I can prove, to a reasonable level of satisfaction, the existence of Apple. Also, they've never told me to kill anybody.
- Qz 17y ago
  I can prove, to a reasonable level of satisfaction, the existence of Jesus, Moses, and Muhammad. The question is whether we believe what they say (or have said). Also, they've never told me to kill anybody.
  - hugh3 17y ago
    I'm not interested in whether the historical Jesus, Moses or Muhammad existed, I'm interested in the much more dubious existence of their boss. And if Muhammad never told you to kill anybody, he sure wrote a lot of things (or alternatively, transcribed a lot of things dictated by Allah) which are awfully easy to interpret that way: http://www.yoel.info/koranwarpassages.htm http://www.yoel.info/koranwarpassages.htm . Apple, on the other hand, tends to steer well clear of telling anybody to kill anybody, as far as I know.
  - nickelplate 17y ago
    Unless you can prove the existence of a Jesus who has been resurrected, a Moses who walked on the sea or a Muhamad who rode a flying horse to Heaven, I doubt your proof would satisfy most people.
    - Qz 17y ago
      Those are things that people said that Jesus/Moses/Muhammad did, and consequentially not what I'm claiming proof for. My claim is only that they existed. Whether we believe what they said, or what other people say about them, is another question entirely. Going back to the original point: "At least I can prove, to a reasonable level of satisfaction, the existence of Apple." No one is arguing Apple's existence, the debate is whether what Apple says and what is said about Apple is true. The Bible says Jesus was resurrected. Apple says iPad is magical. Pundits say iPad is the future of computing. Is it true? I don't know. But it's all the same kind of mysticism.

I think that's the point, not the irony: "we believe in an actual deity who does various things, whereas elite Westerners believe in a manufacturer of gadgets."

by asolove 17y ago

I think that's the point, not the irony: "we believe in an actual deity who does various things, whereas elite Westerners believe in a manufacturer of gadgets."

hugh3 17y ago

At least I can prove, to a reasonable level of satisfaction, the existence of Apple. Also, they've never told me to kill anybody.

Qz 17y ago
I can prove, to a reasonable level of satisfaction, the existence of Jesus, Moses, and Muhammad. The question is whether we believe what they say (or have said). Also, they've never told me to kill anybody.
- hugh3 17y ago
  I'm not interested in whether the historical Jesus, Moses or Muhammad existed, I'm interested in the much more dubious existence of their boss. And if Muhammad never told you to kill anybody, he sure wrote a lot of things (or alternatively, transcribed a lot of things dictated by Allah) which are awfully easy to interpret that way: http://www.yoel.info/koranwarpassages.htm http://www.yoel.info/koranwarpassages.htm . Apple, on the other hand, tends to steer well clear of telling anybody to kill anybody, as far as I know.
- nickelplate 17y ago
  Unless you can prove the existence of a Jesus who has been resurrected, a Moses who walked on the sea or a Muhamad who rode a flying horse to Heaven, I doubt your proof would satisfy most people.
  - Qz 17y ago
    Those are things that people said that Jesus/Moses/Muhammad did, and consequentially not what I'm claiming proof for. My claim is only that they existed. Whether we believe what they said, or what other people say about them, is another question entirely. Going back to the original point: "At least I can prove, to a reasonable level of satisfaction, the existence of Apple." No one is arguing Apple's existence, the debate is whether what Apple says and what is said about Apple is true. The Bible says Jesus was resurrected. Apple says iPad is magical. Pundits say iPad is the future of computing. Is it true? I don't know. But it's all the same kind of mysticism.