5 ms·

Craft beer in portland just means "more hops." I call it crap beer. Fully agree with your post, just felt like griping about "craft" beer here.

ksk 10y ago
On that note, why are there so many new IPAs in PNW? I like IPAs, but I doubt most people want them.
- st3v3r 10y ago
  On the contrary, that's why so many are made.
- Kluny 10y ago
  My theory: they taste like pine trees, and we've got a lot of pine trees, so it just feels right. Try drinking an IPA in Mexico sometimes. Super inappropes. But in PNW it makes sense. For awhile, til you get sick of it.
  - throwanem 10y ago
    Pine trees smell good. They do not taste good.
  - unprepare 10y ago
    We've got a lot of pinetrees in michigan as well, but we generally dont have these super hoppy styles. I think theres also regional hop variations, so maybe theyre just less piney here.
    - Bartweiss 10y ago
      Cascade hops are super strong, and are grown out in the PNW/Colorado area, so that's a big chunk of the problem. Other hop varieties lend themselves much better to malty beers, or to darker options where the bitterness is more subtle.
    - emodendroket 10y ago
      Pine trees are even on the flag for New England.
  - logfromblammo 10y ago
    Here's an idea for a craft brew. Replace the hops with actual white pine needles. And Googling for "beer with pine needles"... ...dammit. "Spruce beer". That idea is literally centuries old. At least five breweries currently use evergreen bits as flavoring agents, and at least 16 have tried reviving gruit recipes in some form or another. Apparently, Sitka spruce tips are popular in Alaska, being far more available than hops.
    - wiredfool 10y ago
      Yeah, the Alaskan Winter ale with spruce tips is good. Not as good as their Alaskan Amber alt beer. (Though, it's a bit variable, sometimes it's good, and sometimes it's the nectar of the gods.) (Personally, I wasn't a fan of IPAs before they got big, but preferred the amber -> porter/stout range)
- jabl 10y ago
  Don't know about PNW (Pacific Northwest??), but at least over here (northern Europe) IPAs are terribly trendy, you can find them in every grocery store. I suppose it's some worldwide trend..
- DaveMebs 10y ago
  80% of hops in America come from the Yakima Valley, which is in Eastern Washington. They even have a large hop festival every year. I think this presence influences the beer scene dramatically.
- JeremyMorgan 10y ago
  The same reason there are so many JS frameworks.
wcummings 10y ago
Not just Portland, the entire American craft beer scene is infected with shitty, indistinguishable IPA's that all taste like a mountain of hops.
- enjo 10y ago
  There are definitely a lot of bad IPA's, but that's hardly even a significant part of the American Craft Beer scene these days.
  - pfranz 10y ago
    Googling "west coast beer style" has this[0] as the first result. You could argue that this isn't a canonical source or that things have changed since the thread in 2011--but the stigma is still around. [0] https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/forum/index.php?topic=6498.0 https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/forum/index.php?topic...
    - Bartweiss 10y ago
      I would argue that the IPA fandom hasn't diminished (especially out west), but other things have arisen alongside it. On the east coast, I see an impressive number of sours and dubbels coming out of craft shops, and the midwest is big on bold, malty offerings like ambers and oatmeal stouts.
      - pfranz 10y ago
        I haven't seen IPAs drop in popularity (I much prefer darker, maltier beers), but I do feel like more recently IPAs have tried to use hops in more interesting ways instead of just going for XIPA/DIPA. I hope if hops stay around this trend continues. I would have thought the hops shortage of 2008 would have forced breweries to try something else, so by now it's probably demand driven. I hear there's a new hops shortage coming up.
        Bartweiss 10y ago
SapphireSun 10y ago
The reason IPA is so popular is because for so long the american beer landscape was dominated by brews like Budwiser that are quite weakly flavored. This was an artifact of prohibition destroying most of the competitive landscape with the survivors dominating the market for decades and in turn using anticompetitive laws to their advantage. IPA is a reaction against that flavor profile. You'll be starting to see new flavors come about as people (like yourself) become tired of IPAs.
- pfranz 10y ago
  Why not flavor with malts? I haven't looked into the history of American beer, but many styles seem to come from the price of local ingredients and qualities of local water. That makes me things hops were cheap and plentiful and caused the IPA trend.
  - SapphireSun 10y ago
    I'm not a super expert, this is just what my friends in the biz have told me. I wouldn't be surprised if several factors conspired to create the IPA trend. Yes, there are many ways to infuse flavor into beer, some of which you mentioned above. My friends make IPA styles, but also many others using all kinds of tricks like malts, waters with different minerals, pHs, different base ingredients, brewing wheat in different ways. My buddy even domesticated a new strain of yeast. If you're in Boston, give Aeronaut Brewery in Somerville a try (https://goo.gl/maps/bm22XaBvFPQ2 https://goo.gl/maps/bm22XaBvFPQ2). I have something of an interest of it, but I (unsurprisingly) recommend them.
    - Bartweiss 10y ago
      Aeronaut is a great option for some new flavors. They do all-out hoppy IPAs, but if that's not your thing the other options are distinctive and tasty.
  - hx87 10y ago
    I have wondered about the same thing--both hoppiness and maltiness are good reactions against bland mass market beers, but somehow big malts never took off the way hoppy IPAs did. Is it difficult/expensive to make malty beers?

ksk 10y ago

On that note, why are there so many new IPAs in PNW? I like IPAs, but I doubt most people want them.

st3v3r 10y ago
On the contrary, that's why so many are made.
Kluny 10y ago
My theory: they taste like pine trees, and we've got a lot of pine trees, so it just feels right. Try drinking an IPA in Mexico sometimes. Super inappropes. But in PNW it makes sense. For awhile, til you get sick of it.
- throwanem 10y ago
  Pine trees smell good. They do not taste good.
- unprepare 10y ago
  We've got a lot of pinetrees in michigan as well, but we generally dont have these super hoppy styles. I think theres also regional hop variations, so maybe theyre just less piney here.
  - Bartweiss 10y ago
    Cascade hops are super strong, and are grown out in the PNW/Colorado area, so that's a big chunk of the problem. Other hop varieties lend themselves much better to malty beers, or to darker options where the bitterness is more subtle.
  - emodendroket 10y ago
    Pine trees are even on the flag for New England.
- logfromblammo 10y ago
  Here's an idea for a craft brew. Replace the hops with actual white pine needles. And Googling for "beer with pine needles"... ...dammit. "Spruce beer". That idea is literally centuries old. At least five breweries currently use evergreen bits as flavoring agents, and at least 16 have tried reviving gruit recipes in some form or another. Apparently, Sitka spruce tips are popular in Alaska, being far more available than hops.
  - wiredfool 10y ago
    Yeah, the Alaskan Winter ale with spruce tips is good. Not as good as their Alaskan Amber alt beer. (Though, it's a bit variable, sometimes it's good, and sometimes it's the nectar of the gods.) (Personally, I wasn't a fan of IPAs before they got big, but preferred the amber -> porter/stout range)
jabl 10y ago
Don't know about PNW (Pacific Northwest??), but at least over here (northern Europe) IPAs are terribly trendy, you can find them in every grocery store. I suppose it's some worldwide trend..
DaveMebs 10y ago
80% of hops in America come from the Yakima Valley, which is in Eastern Washington. They even have a large hop festival every year. I think this presence influences the beer scene dramatically.
JeremyMorgan 10y ago
The same reason there are so many JS frameworks.

wcummings 10y ago

Not just Portland, the entire American craft beer scene is infected with shitty, indistinguishable IPA's that all taste like a mountain of hops.

enjo 10y ago
There are definitely a lot of bad IPA's, but that's hardly even a significant part of the American Craft Beer scene these days.
- pfranz 10y ago
  Googling "west coast beer style" has this[0] as the first result. You could argue that this isn't a canonical source or that things have changed since the thread in 2011--but the stigma is still around. [0] https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/forum/index.php?topic=6498.0 https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/forum/index.php?topic...
  - Bartweiss 10y ago
    I would argue that the IPA fandom hasn't diminished (especially out west), but other things have arisen alongside it. On the east coast, I see an impressive number of sours and dubbels coming out of craft shops, and the midwest is big on bold, malty offerings like ambers and oatmeal stouts.
    - pfranz 10y ago
      I haven't seen IPAs drop in popularity (I much prefer darker, maltier beers), but I do feel like more recently IPAs have tried to use hops in more interesting ways instead of just going for XIPA/DIPA. I hope if hops stay around this trend continues. I would have thought the hops shortage of 2008 would have forced breweries to try something else, so by now it's probably demand driven. I hear there's a new hops shortage coming up.
      - Bartweiss 10y ago

SapphireSun 10y ago

The reason IPA is so popular is because for so long the american beer landscape was dominated by brews like Budwiser that are quite weakly flavored. This was an artifact of prohibition destroying most of the competitive landscape with the survivors dominating the market for decades and in turn using anticompetitive laws to their advantage. IPA is a reaction against that flavor profile. You'll be starting to see new flavors come about as people (like yourself) become tired of IPAs.

pfranz 10y ago
Why not flavor with malts? I haven't looked into the history of American beer, but many styles seem to come from the price of local ingredients and qualities of local water. That makes me things hops were cheap and plentiful and caused the IPA trend.
- SapphireSun 10y ago
  I'm not a super expert, this is just what my friends in the biz have told me. I wouldn't be surprised if several factors conspired to create the IPA trend. Yes, there are many ways to infuse flavor into beer, some of which you mentioned above. My friends make IPA styles, but also many others using all kinds of tricks like malts, waters with different minerals, pHs, different base ingredients, brewing wheat in different ways. My buddy even domesticated a new strain of yeast. If you're in Boston, give Aeronaut Brewery in Somerville a try (https://goo.gl/maps/bm22XaBvFPQ2 https://goo.gl/maps/bm22XaBvFPQ2). I have something of an interest of it, but I (unsurprisingly) recommend them.
  - Bartweiss 10y ago
    Aeronaut is a great option for some new flavors. They do all-out hoppy IPAs, but if that's not your thing the other options are distinctive and tasty.
- hx87 10y ago
  I have wondered about the same thing--both hoppiness and maltiness are good reactions against bland mass market beers, but somehow big malts never took off the way hoppy IPAs did. Is it difficult/expensive to make malty beers?