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Al Capone was a gangster. Does that unfounded accusation also inflame your sense of justice? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 'Innocent until proven guilty' concerns the court syst

by ajamesm 10y ago

Al Capone was a gangster. Does that unfounded accusation also inflame your sense of justice? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 'Innocent until proven guilty' concerns the court system, but not the rest of civil society. If someone throws up all the red flags of a rapist, nobody is obligated to balk at them.

logfromblammo 10y ago
Al Capone was a tax evader! How dare you slander such an otherwise upstanding, legitimate businessman with accusations of crimes of far greater severity than those which were actually proven beyond reasonable doubt by prosecutors!~
jshevek 10y ago
> 'Innocent until proven guilty' concerns the court system, but not the rest of civil society. To be a truly civil society, we have a moral obligation to raise ourselves to this standard.
mschuster91 10y ago
> 'Innocent until proven guilty' concerns the court system, but not the rest of civil society. Oh no, it does concern society as a whole, or otherwise libel and defamation would not be classified as crimes...
- deleted 10y ago
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- ajamesm 10y ago
  > Until a court has convicted Appelbaum of the crime of rape, he is not a rapist. Let's be clear that there's a vast difference between "a court has not convicted him of that crime" vs "he did not commit that crime". A statement can be factually true, even if you can't prove it in court and thereby you lack a legal defense against defamation. Legally, I'm defaming Al Capone right now, because was into racketeering. It might be unwise to say that, as it would open me to prosecution, but it's certainly not untrue for that reason. (I've thoughtfully considered the risk, and will accept any libel charges from his estate.) In any case, were Al Capone still alive, you would have to be a complete idiot to treat him as anything but a gangster. Feel free to extend the analogy on your own, and conclude what you will about the public figures in tech who face several rape accusations.

by ajamesm 10y ago

logfromblammo 10y ago

Al Capone was a tax evader! How dare you slander such an otherwise upstanding, legitimate businessman with accusations of crimes of far greater severity than those which were actually proven beyond reasonable doubt by prosecutors!~

jshevek 10y ago

> 'Innocent until proven guilty' concerns the court system, but not the rest of civil society. To be a truly civil society, we have a moral obligation to raise ourselves to this standard.

mschuster91 10y ago

> 'Innocent until proven guilty' concerns the court system, but not the rest of civil society. Oh no, it does concern society as a whole, or otherwise libel and defamation would not be classified as crimes...

deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
ajamesm 10y ago
> Until a court has convicted Appelbaum of the crime of rape, he is not a rapist. Let's be clear that there's a vast difference between "a court has not convicted him of that crime" vs "he did not commit that crime". A statement can be factually true, even if you can't prove it in court and thereby you lack a legal defense against defamation. Legally, I'm defaming Al Capone right now, because was into racketeering. It might be unwise to say that, as it would open me to prosecution, but it's certainly not untrue for that reason. (I've thoughtfully considered the risk, and will accept any libel charges from his estate.) In any case, were Al Capone still alive, you would have to be a complete idiot to treat him as anything but a gangster. Feel free to extend the analogy on your own, and conclude what you will about the public figures in tech who face several rape accusations.