4 ms·

For me, the issue is that intellectuals, futurists, etc constantly downplay the crucial cultural role that cars play as part of our identity in America. Americ

For me, the issue is that intellectuals, futurists, etc constantly downplay the crucial cultural role that cars play as part of our identity in America. America has really shitty public transit, so on average, you're driving (or being driven) somewhere and seeing other people driving. America is also a place that encourages and celebrates individuality (for better or worse). At the same time, it's a country of sub-cultures and mixed cultural identities. So you get people buying cars that they think fit their personal identity and their sub culture. Prius(i?) were a statement for the conscious movement, but it's damning that Toyota never pushed the bar further and explored (until recently) other cultural identity vehicles as eco-conscious (like Tacomas, imagine how awesome that would be!). tl;dr - cars are critical to American culture, and not just as practical tools for moving around. Even if you think you buy a prius because you "don't care" - that unto itself is a cultural and style decision you are making to express yourself. Hoodies forever. side rant: Why Tesla is the only car company to make an electric (or even hybrid) that doesn't look like vanilla boring practical dogshit is beyond me.

Florin_Andrei 10y ago
In one corner, cultural identity, a shared, commonly accepted fantasy, a set of semi-arbitrary rules for a role-playing game. In the other corner, the effort to stop the transformation of Earth into a smoldering pile of garbage that cannot sustain human life. It's a fight that "makes sense".
- bdcravens 10y ago
  I think you're painting a false dichotomy.
  - Florin_Andrei 10y ago
    Well... maybe. Sort of. But not really. It's satire. It's a way of cranking up the Sharpen filter all the way to 100, to make things more obvious. Clearly the contradiction right now is not as bad as that - but it could be, there are future timelines that could be conceived in ways similar to that. What I'm saying is - there's a dystopia in the future that looks like that. Let's make sure we don't take the wrong fork in the multiverse road and end up there somehow.
blacksmith_tb 10y ago
Granted, though compare the aggressive campaigns of the past 30 years in the US to make smoking cigarettes uncool. A couple of generations ago, it was just a commonplace that people (mostly men) smoked, and certainly cool ones (say, in films) did. What we need now is a similar campaign to uncool huge, inefficient vehicles, and redirect the next generation of car-culture into efficiency in general, and electricity specifically (though adding a few more turbochargers in the meantime is a good start, and does sound cool).
- ndonnellan 10y ago
  Or tax carbon. And let markets [probably] decide which efficiencies to prioritize. Not that it's politically feasible...
xenadu02 10y ago
> America has really shitty public transit And it wasn't an accident either. The car companies actively campaigned to tear up and dismantle public transit. Dallas used to have a huge streetcar network; all that remains is the M uptown line. Even here in San Francisco the anti-public-transit movement managed to tear down the A and B lines (among others; The A line used to run down Geary to the beach and the B line turned south and ran down 19th Ave.)
- wizardforhire 10y ago
  Oklahoma City had an extensive electric street car network that was eventually dismantled. http://www.acogok.org/transportation-planning/maps-and-data/historical-streetcar-routes/ http://www.acogok.org/transportation-planning/maps-and-data/... There are plans in the works to build a new light rail system. The trains were just purchased earlier this year. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oklahoma_City_Streetcar https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oklahoma_City_Streetcar
- knz 10y ago
  Distain for public transport is effectively the default position for some politicians (and therefore their supporters) in some parts of the country regardless of the inefficiencies obvious during every commute. Having travelled to countries with good transit, it's so obvious that it makes more sense for urban areas. Somehow the Danes make it work out to smaller seaside towns (Helsingor to Hornbaek) but I'd settle for a few transit lines in my local urban area (3.3M). I've often day dreamed about building a bot that sends a screenshot of traffic in Google Maps to my local representatives at 0830 and 1700 every day. Perhaps with the words "PLEASE fix my bloody commute" overlayed... the thought usually comes to me as I cross the 10 lane Wakota Bridge over the Mississippi that was recently replaced. Despite hundreds of millions of dollars, traffic still grinds to a halt at the same spot every damn day.
twistedanimator 10y ago
I think the reason car companies besides Tesla make ugly electric/hybrid cars is because they really don't want you to buy them. I assume at this point, both car companies and the oil industry are intertwined to such a degree that it's not in their financial interest to disrupt the status quo. My next car will hopefully be a Tesla, but I cannot afford the Model S no matter how much I'd like one.
- enraged_camel 10y ago
  The exact same thing happened with Kodak. They invented the digital camera in the 70s, but refused to capitalize on it because they were too heavily invested in film cameras and had thousands of people all over the US employed in some capacity manufacturing them. The rest is history.
brightball 10y ago
I always really liked the look of the Volt. It was a lease but I still miss that car...a lot.

Florin_Andrei 10y ago

In one corner, cultural identity, a shared, commonly accepted fantasy, a set of semi-arbitrary rules for a role-playing game. In the other corner, the effort to stop the transformation of Earth into a smoldering pile of garbage that cannot sustain human life. It's a fight that "makes sense".

bdcravens 10y ago
I think you're painting a false dichotomy.
- Florin_Andrei 10y ago
  Well... maybe. Sort of. But not really. It's satire. It's a way of cranking up the Sharpen filter all the way to 100, to make things more obvious. Clearly the contradiction right now is not as bad as that - but it could be, there are future timelines that could be conceived in ways similar to that. What I'm saying is - there's a dystopia in the future that looks like that. Let's make sure we don't take the wrong fork in the multiverse road and end up there somehow.

blacksmith_tb 10y ago

Granted, though compare the aggressive campaigns of the past 30 years in the US to make smoking cigarettes uncool. A couple of generations ago, it was just a commonplace that people (mostly men) smoked, and certainly cool ones (say, in films) did. What we need now is a similar campaign to uncool huge, inefficient vehicles, and redirect the next generation of car-culture into efficiency in general, and electricity specifically (though adding a few more turbochargers in the meantime is a good start, and does sound cool).

ndonnellan 10y ago
Or tax carbon. And let markets [probably] decide which efficiencies to prioritize. Not that it's politically feasible...

xenadu02 10y ago

> America has really shitty public transit And it wasn't an accident either. The car companies actively campaigned to tear up and dismantle public transit. Dallas used to have a huge streetcar network; all that remains is the M uptown line. Even here in San Francisco the anti-public-transit movement managed to tear down the A and B lines (among others; The A line used to run down Geary to the beach and the B line turned south and ran down 19th Ave.)

wizardforhire 10y ago
Oklahoma City had an extensive electric street car network that was eventually dismantled. http://www.acogok.org/transportation-planning/maps-and-data/historical-streetcar-routes/ http://www.acogok.org/transportation-planning/maps-and-data/... There are plans in the works to build a new light rail system. The trains were just purchased earlier this year. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oklahoma_City_Streetcar https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oklahoma_City_Streetcar
knz 10y ago
Distain for public transport is effectively the default position for some politicians (and therefore their supporters) in some parts of the country regardless of the inefficiencies obvious during every commute. Having travelled to countries with good transit, it's so obvious that it makes more sense for urban areas. Somehow the Danes make it work out to smaller seaside towns (Helsingor to Hornbaek) but I'd settle for a few transit lines in my local urban area (3.3M). I've often day dreamed about building a bot that sends a screenshot of traffic in Google Maps to my local representatives at 0830 and 1700 every day. Perhaps with the words "PLEASE fix my bloody commute" overlayed... the thought usually comes to me as I cross the 10 lane Wakota Bridge over the Mississippi that was recently replaced. Despite hundreds of millions of dollars, traffic still grinds to a halt at the same spot every damn day.

twistedanimator 10y ago

I think the reason car companies besides Tesla make ugly electric/hybrid cars is because they really don't want you to buy them. I assume at this point, both car companies and the oil industry are intertwined to such a degree that it's not in their financial interest to disrupt the status quo. My next car will hopefully be a Tesla, but I cannot afford the Model S no matter how much I'd like one.

enraged_camel 10y ago
The exact same thing happened with Kodak. They invented the digital camera in the 70s, but refused to capitalize on it because they were too heavily invested in film cameras and had thousands of people all over the US employed in some capacity manufacturing them. The rest is history.

brightball 10y ago

I always really liked the look of the Volt. It was a lease but I still miss that car...a lot.