4 ms·

What a farce. Remind me again why this is killing Django and Rails for mindshare? (I'm serious, somebody please remind me.)

rch 10y ago
Node certainly has nontrivial mindshare, but I don't get the impression that is 'killing' other platforms.
thesmallestcat 10y ago
What is the farce? That packages can be unpublished? PyPI allows this. So does RubyGems.
- tedmiston 10y ago
  That people have depended on a meaningless package, presumably unintentionally.
micaksica 10y ago
Because for a good chunk of the "web developer" or "web programmer" community, Node.js leverages the HTML/CSS/JS skillset they already have honed writing WordPress plugins and themes. It's easier to get adoption of your platform when it's a syntax one-trick-pony mom and pop "website design" companies understand, because now with some tutorials they can say that they, too, can write server side code.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- atoko 10y ago
  Ssh it's ok. None of us will take your place as a "real programmer" :)
- nilliams 10y ago
  Forgive me for a blunt reply to your snarky comment, but this is ignorant hyperbole, and I'm surprised you got away with it on HN. I've never written 'WordPress plugins and themes'. I've worked in C, Java, PHP, Python, Ruby. Yet I gravitate to Node for backends because it makes sense for many reasons over alternative platforms that are still playing catch-up in terms of practical solutions. One example: Node had solid websockets solutions from close to day one. Several years later, Django just added 'channels' to its org. Rails just added 'action cable'. Both feel very immature. Also Python and Ruby are slow as hell compared to Node.
nilliams 10y ago
>> Remind me again why this is killing Django and Rails for mindshare Staying specific to package managers (which the article is about), Python's Pip doesn't have a dependency resolver [0] and Python packaging is miserable without using virtualenvs, which is frustrating overhead. Also the setup.py situation is a hot, unstandardised mess. As far as Ruby goes, (I don't have as much experience here, but ...) Rubygems seems hella slow, and the require story sucks compared to npm. Do I have to require 'rubygems'?, should I require_relative? In my book npm has both beat for 'is fast' and 'just works'. [0] https://github.com/pypa/pip/issues/988 https://github.com/pypa/pip/issues/988
- stouset 10y ago
  > Do I have to require 'rubygems'? No. Never. Your code should not expect/require a particular dependency manager. > should I require_relative? This has nothing to do with package management, and the answer is again, "no, never" if you're trying to require a gem. This is to require files from within your own projects.
  - nilliams 10y ago
    > Do I have to require 'rubygems'? >> No. Never. Your code should not expect/require a particular dependency manager But there's loads of code out there that does that. So the answer isn't clear. > should I require_relative? >> This has nothing to do with package management, [...] It's to do with the interplay between what you install via package management and what you require. In Node you require a package by the same name as you install it, and there's one `require()`, end of story. In Ruby, it's less clear. That's what I meant. If you want a further example: Why do I `gem install activesupport`, but `require 'active_support'`?

rch 10y ago

Node certainly has nontrivial mindshare, but I don't get the impression that is 'killing' other platforms.

thesmallestcat 10y ago

What is the farce? That packages can be unpublished? PyPI allows this. So does RubyGems.

tedmiston 10y ago
That people have depended on a meaningless package, presumably unintentionally.

micaksica 10y ago

Because for a good chunk of the "web developer" or "web programmer" community, Node.js leverages the HTML/CSS/JS skillset they already have honed writing WordPress plugins and themes. It's easier to get adoption of your platform when it's a syntax one-trick-pony mom and pop "website design" companies understand, because now with some tutorials they can say that they, too, can write server side code.

deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
atoko 10y ago
Ssh it's ok. None of us will take your place as a "real programmer" :)
nilliams 10y ago
Forgive me for a blunt reply to your snarky comment, but this is ignorant hyperbole, and I'm surprised you got away with it on HN. I've never written 'WordPress plugins and themes'. I've worked in C, Java, PHP, Python, Ruby. Yet I gravitate to Node for backends because it makes sense for many reasons over alternative platforms that are still playing catch-up in terms of practical solutions. One example: Node had solid websockets solutions from close to day one. Several years later, Django just added 'channels' to its org. Rails just added 'action cable'. Both feel very immature. Also Python and Ruby are slow as hell compared to Node.

nilliams 10y ago

>> Remind me again why this is killing Django and Rails for mindshare Staying specific to package managers (which the article is about), Python's Pip doesn't have a dependency resolver [0] and Python packaging is miserable without using virtualenvs, which is frustrating overhead. Also the setup.py situation is a hot, unstandardised mess. As far as Ruby goes, (I don't have as much experience here, but ...) Rubygems seems hella slow, and the require story sucks compared to npm. Do I have to require 'rubygems'?, should I require_relative? In my book npm has both beat for 'is fast' and 'just works'. [0] https://github.com/pypa/pip/issues/988 https://github.com/pypa/pip/issues/988

stouset 10y ago
> Do I have to require 'rubygems'? No. Never. Your code should not expect/require a particular dependency manager. > should I require_relative? This has nothing to do with package management, and the answer is again, "no, never" if you're trying to require a gem. This is to require files from within your own projects.
- nilliams 10y ago
  > Do I have to require 'rubygems'? >> No. Never. Your code should not expect/require a particular dependency manager But there's loads of code out there that does that. So the answer isn't clear. > should I require_relative? >> This has nothing to do with package management, [...] It's to do with the interplay between what you install via package management and what you require. In Node you require a package by the same name as you install it, and there's one `require()`, end of story. In Ruby, it's less clear. That's what I meant. If you want a further example: Why do I `gem install activesupport`, but `require 'active_support'`?