3 ms·

>Often the case anyway. Because of a failure of negotiation. For negotiation to work you need leverage, and being an asset to your company is the obvious way t

>Often the case anyway. Because of a failure of negotiation. For negotiation to work you need leverage, and being an asset to your company is the obvious way to generate it.

crdoconnor 10y ago
There's plenty of markets dominated by non-technical employers hiring programmers and they have no clue how to assess how good you are. Hence they all use poor rules of thumb and treat people like cogs. 1x and 10x developers get more or less the same offers. Not a failure of negotiation. The only way to win that negotiation is to exit the market (if you even can).
- mixedCase 10y ago
  >Not a failure of negotiation. The only way to win that negotiation is to exit the market (if you even can). For non-technical people, you have to paint to the other person the picture of what's going to happen if you quit, and for him/her to realize that they do not understand the scope of what you do. It's not guaranteed to work, but that's just like every negotiation tactic out there.
  - crdoconnor 10y ago
    To look at it another way - assume you want to hire somebody and you have no idea what they do. How do you trust the picture of disaster that they're painting if you fire them? The answer is nearly always you have some (poor) rules of thumb and you're skeptical of the ones who say that they're 10x better than the rest.
st3v3r 10y ago
You need leverage, but you need a lot of other things, too. Feeling comfortable negotiating, for one. Given that we're an industry that trends toward the introverted side, that may be hard to come by.
- mixedCase 10y ago
  It's an acquired skill like any other. Sure, social butterflies are more likely to be better at it than the rest of us, but we can still learn it. We owe it to ourselves to overcome our own nature if we want to get what we want.

3 ms·

>Often the case anyway. Because of a failure of negotiation. For negotiation to work you need leverage, and being an asset to your company is the obvious way t

by mixedCase 10y ago

>Often the case anyway. Because of a failure of negotiation. For negotiation to work you need leverage, and being an asset to your company is the obvious way to generate it.

crdoconnor 10y ago
There's plenty of markets dominated by non-technical employers hiring programmers and they have no clue how to assess how good you are. Hence they all use poor rules of thumb and treat people like cogs. 1x and 10x developers get more or less the same offers. Not a failure of negotiation. The only way to win that negotiation is to exit the market (if you even can).
- mixedCase 10y ago
  >Not a failure of negotiation. The only way to win that negotiation is to exit the market (if you even can). For non-technical people, you have to paint to the other person the picture of what's going to happen if you quit, and for him/her to realize that they do not understand the scope of what you do. It's not guaranteed to work, but that's just like every negotiation tactic out there.
  - crdoconnor 10y ago
    To look at it another way - assume you want to hire somebody and you have no idea what they do. How do you trust the picture of disaster that they're painting if you fire them? The answer is nearly always you have some (poor) rules of thumb and you're skeptical of the ones who say that they're 10x better than the rest.
st3v3r 10y ago
You need leverage, but you need a lot of other things, too. Feeling comfortable negotiating, for one. Given that we're an industry that trends toward the introverted side, that may be hard to come by.
- mixedCase 10y ago
  It's an acquired skill like any other. Sure, social butterflies are more likely to be better at it than the rest of us, but we can still learn it. We owe it to ourselves to overcome our own nature if we want to get what we want.